Copyright issues - Split from Galapagos Fatality

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Well, the law says that the writer maintains ownership and that it is a copyright violation to reproduce it without permission. ScubaBoard is responsible to take it down if the owner complains, or they become liable for the violation. Whoever posted the material is responsible from the time they posted it.

It is my view, and I think the view of at least some others as well that it is unethical to post a substantial article written and published by someone else without permission, especially when a link to that material can be provided without violating the author's rights. It is marginally ethical for ScubaBoard to leave these posts up. It would be more ethical to discourage copyright violation by posters and encourage the posting of links to such materials if permission for reproduction has not been acquired. Deleting articles when the author complains follows the letter of the law, but deleting them as soon as you know they are there is closer to the spirit.

SUURE...:coffee:

You are telling me that you would rather not have this valuable thread here, because it may theoretically be claimed by the author?:confused:

The poster made clear its from someones blog, and whoever posted it on the blog in the internet pretty much voluntarily gave up any privacy whatsoever.

I can only repeat what I said earlier: we should be thankful that someone took the time to initiate this useful discussion, which may have potentially saved another life by pointing out a number of risks and preventing someone from diving galapagos without doing their homework.

I take that over "potential", "maybe" infringements anytime!!!
 
SUURE...:coffee:

You are telling me that you would rather not have this valuable thread here, because it may theoretically be claimed by the author?:confused:

The poster made clear its from someones blog, and whoever posted it on the blog in the internet pretty much voluntarily gave up any privacy whatsoever.

I can only repeat what I said earlier: we should be thankful that someone took the time to initiate this useful discussion, which may have potentially saved another life by pointing out a number of risks and preventing someone from diving galapagos without doing their homework.

I take that over "potential", "maybe" infringements anytime!!!

It's not a "potential", "maybe" infringement. Unless the person who copied/pasted the text obtained the permission of the author first, it IS an infringement. It's not about privacy, it's about ownership of your own writing. It matters not at all that "the poster made clear its from someones blog." Without permission, it is infringement, and it's illegal.

They could have initiated the same useful discussion by posting a link to the original without violating anyone's copyright.

The rise of the internet has been accompanied by a decline in people's respect for intellectual property.
 
We should get this discussion split off, but how exactly do you think fair use applies here? Copying an entire article fails the test for "fair use" by replicating an entire work. "Fair use" would allow one to take a line or two, or to summarize the article and link to it, not to copy it completely.
 
SUURE...:coffee:

The poster made clear its from someones blog, and whoever posted it on the blog in the internet pretty much voluntarily gave up any privacy whatsoever.

I don't believe that's the case at all? You write a book, you get copywrite protection - why not a blog?
 
FWIW, I had an e-mail exchange Feb 23 with the blog's author John Bisnar. The following is one paragraph from his response to my question:

"Some great points have been raised in the comments to this article both
on my site and on others. It has apparently been copied on to a number
of websites, which was our intention."
 
It has apparently been copied on to a number
of websites, which was our intention."
Well, that settles that!

ScubaBoard does not have the manpower to research each and every image or post to verify ownership. However, should an author contact us with a link(s) to their copyrighted material, we will gladly remove it in due course.
 
Copying an entire article fails the test for "fair use" by replicating an entire work. "Fair use" would allow one to take a line or two, or to summarize the article and link to it, not to copy it completely.

Well, he may have replicated it, but in no way passed it off as his own.

Fair use is not limited to "a line or two"

Welcome to the interwebs - this happens ALL THE TIME (perceived copyright infringements and people getting their panties in a bunch)
 
Pete, that's a standard policy of the typical website and it sounds like a cop-out. What you describe is the absolute minimum for which you are responsible. I can appreciate that a mostly volunteer organization cannot be expected to run down every possible lead, however there are a few compromises that I would like for you to consider.

First, do something proactive to let your participants know that it is technically illegal to replicate a substantial portion of an authors article on this site without permission. Policies should encourage posting of links and summarization of facts rather than cut-and-paste. This should be a key point just like the no-posting-of-names in the Special Rules thread.

Second, this happens with such frequency that there are plenty of obvious violations which would require almost no research before converting the reproduction of an article into a link. See, for example, the first two posts of this thread. The first post, by attribution, was a work clearly written by someone other than the poster. The second post represented someone posting the link back to the original. The OP should have set it up that way in the first place, and ScubaBoard should promote and require that in an attempt to be a good internet neighbor. However, when someone posts like this, it's really a no-brainer for a mod to snip it down as was done for this thread. Doubts should be resolved in favor of the content owner if there aren't enough resources for research.

Third, a little goes a long way. The general policy and attitude here is one of entitlement with regard to these issues. There is very little respect for the rights of authors who aren't posting here. A few changes to policy and practice could change the culture in a positive way. Clearly, it is important to many of us here to understand and learn from things that happen in the diving community, both good and bad. We can do that just as well with summaries and links as with complete replications of the work of others. If there is a little education and a little enforcement, maybe people will start to do things the "right" way.

Fourth, ScubaBoard should be interested in self-preservation. While it is accepted a host isn't directly responsible for what a visitor posts on their site as long as they remove it upon request, the laws are still evolving. I wouldn't have to stretch much to see an attorney make a case that ScubaBoard's policies promote the theft of copyright and that they should therefore be liable in some fashion for the violations. It would take little effort to locate dozens of cut and paste replications of accident reports and related articles among other things to show such a pattern.


With regard to "fair use", there are a number of characteristics that are examined to decide a case. The standard set are as follows:

1. The nature and purpose of use of copyrighted work. For example, is there an intent to profit from the reproduction. The only direct profit made from these is in the form of ScubaBoard's increased traffic and advertising revenues, but that is largely discounted. There is also leeway when the use is for educational purposes, and one could argue that this is often the case here. Personally, I would argue that the educational intent could be served equally well by summary and link without the copyright violation.

2. The nature of the original work. In this case, it would not be obvious that the author had the intent for the work to be copied all over the internet. In fact, the copyright statement at the bottom of the page would suggest just the opposite. As I read the original, I get the impression that it exists as a sort of advertisement for the services offered by the author's firm. That is an end which is not well served when the entire article is replicated on another site, especially without a link back to the original.

3. The substantiality of the use. This is an examination of the percentage of the original work that has been replicated. While there is no overall rule about the number of lines that may be reproduced, the larger the percentage of the whole that is taken, the less likely it is to be considered a "fair use". My reference to a "line or two" in a previous post was based upon my perception of a balance between what would be necessary to convey some meaning versus what would be a substantial reproduction. It is much harder to argue "fair use" when the entire work is replicated as in this case.

4. The impact of the replication. If the original work was created as a means to draw eyes in to the owner's site, then a full replication obviates the need for anyone to go there. That owner's site loses the traffic and potential income from any of their own advertising as those eyes go to another location, like ScubaBoard.


This particular article is reported as intended for replication by the author. That doesn't make it any less valuable to discuss, and hopefully rectify, ScubaBoard's position with respect to the protection of copyright. The penalties for copyright violation can be severe, but more than that, it's unethical.
 
One reason I've seen that a lot of people copy news articles, etc. in their entirety and credit the source, rather than summarizing and linking to them is that many of those are only available for a limited time.

Providing a link to the source, crediting the author and then quoting the article helps preserve the content for future discussion when the original link is no longer valid or the article ends up archived somewhere and inaccessible.

What are the thoughts regarding this?
 

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