Could the scuba community have done something more to prevent Guy Garman's death?

[berk]

"Scuba Diving magazine recognizes this historic attempt for the technical diving community, and sends condolences to his family and friends."

..................oh man

 

[kr2y5]

Nothing the scuba community could have said or done would have deterred him. As already mentioned, only someone with a close personal relationship whose opinion he valued (above his own) may have persuaded him to stop and reconsider.

The people with the very best chance of stopping him were his family, and they were apparently "on board" with the record attempt.

Best wishes.

Really good point, thanks. When in bind, often it is best to have someone else to argue on our behalf. Perhaps trying to reason with his son, who is also a scuba driver, but potentially less emotionally wrapped up in pushing forward, would have had better chances of success.

Unfortunately when you ask the question on a public forum, some people assume exactly what Jax suggested.....and we all need to remember that search engines like Google open this forum to a lot of people who have absolutely no clue at all about scuba diving, but have heard about Doc Deep.

True.

"Scuba Diving magazine recognizes this historic attempt for the technical diving community, and sends condolences to his family and friends."

..................oh man

Oh man indeed... although I guess that's just human nature, trying to give some dignity to the deceased. Certainly doesn't help as a deterrent, though, to say the least...

 

[hroark2112]

The scuba "community" has some amount of controls over divers when it comes to certifications. However, individuals are free to do what they want, with or without the requisite qualifications and experience, and there is no law to stop them. Think about the father & son who died at Eagle's Nest. The scuba community posts signs at the entrance of caves, complete with serious warnings and a Grim Reaper, and people still ignore them.

Do we want anyone to be able to control what we do and when we do it? Do we want the PADI 60' "recommendation" for OW certification to become a law? I'm thinking no, no diver wants that kind of limitation. There may be 1,000,000 reasons why someone shouldn't do a particular dive, but if someone really wants to do it, they're going to do it. I am sure people told him it was a one-way trip, and he ignored it. Luckily he was the only one to pay the ultimate price for his decision.

 

[The Laconic]

The people with the very best chance of stopping him were his family, and they were apparently "on board" with the record attempt.

Although I agree, I'm inclined to give the family a pass. They surely underestimated the risk, but may not have been in any position to know better.

I'm trying to imagine what I would do if my wife were trying to set a record that was dangerous in some way. I'd at least find out whether (and how often) other people died in such attempts, and why. But if there were other people around me who seemed to be experts in the subject, and they were telling me this was different, and the reasons were complex... well, I'd like to think that I'd still be able to judge for myself, but I don't expect the same of everyone.

 

[laurin]

A common plea from most scuba training agencies to Guinness World Records to disregard any scuba record claims might make some people think twice... Or failing a common plea, changing their rules to allow permanently pulling cards or status from instructors/shops taking part in depth record attempts could also send a message.

//LN

 

[Kevrumbo]

“These activities are extremely dangerous, it is inevitable that people will get killed, but that doesn’t make them any less valid as activities,” said Nancy Bouchard, spokeswoman for sponsor Five Ten footwear. “In the back of our minds, we always know something terrible could happen, but that didn’t and doesn’t diminish our feelings for Dean.”. . .

. . .Dean Potter lived on the outer edge of extreme sports and died Saturday pushing the envelope in his beloved Yosemite National Park when he and a friend leaped off Taft Point, some 3,500 feet above the valley floor and crashed into rocks during a dusk flight in bat-like [wing]suits. . .

The deaths of Potter, 43, and Graham Hunt, 29, were a stunning loss and another reminder of the narrow margin for error in the death-defying pursuit of wingsuit flying, a more dangerous offshoot of BASE jumping — parachuting off buildings, antennas, spans (such as bridges) and Earth.

Wingsuit flier thought he could manage the risk, avoid death

Same question: Could the [BASE Jumping/Wing Suit Flying Community] have done something to prevent these deaths? It's a moot question and answer especially in extreme sports. . .

Again the real & obvious point of relevance to learn from these tragedies, is this: Ultimately, each person who ventures out must make his or her own decisions about how far to go and what point to turn back. . .

 

[LeadTurn_SD]

Although I agree, I'm inclined to give the family a pass. They surely underestimated the risk, but may not have been in any position to know better.

I'm trying to imagine what I would do if my wife were trying to set a record that was dangerous in some way. I'd at least find out whether (and how often) other people died in such attempts, and why. But if there were other people around me who seemed to be experts in the subject, and they were telling me this was different, and the reasons were complex... well, I'd like to think that I'd still be able to judge for myself, but I don't expect the same of everyone.

I actually agree with you (I don't "blame" the family at all). I imagine that his family might have had the best chance to stop him (maybe), but they were less knowledgeable and less trained than he was and thus would likely defer to his judgement, they would really want to support him, they understood that the endeavor is very risky but are convinced that if anyone can do it he can (being that close to someone often erases objectivity)... and his string of successes probably encouraged them.

I think that the personality-type that goes after record depths after so short a time diving would be pretty difficult to "deflect" from a major goal; family might have the best shot, but even then it was probably a long shot.

Best wishes.

 

[rickgillyon]

I'm trying to imagine what I would do if my wife were trying to set a record that was dangerous in some way. I'd at least find out whether (and how often) other people died in such attempts, and why.

And if you found out there was a danger as real and probable as HPNS at 350m?

 

[The Laconic]

And if you found out there was a danger as real and probable as HPNS at 350m?

I imagine a mixture of heartfelt pleas, rational arguments, and screaming, culminating in divorce if there was no alternative.

 

[Manneca]

I find a disturbing amount of machismo in the male diving community. When I dive, there is an assumption that because I'm AOW, I want to dive to 100 feet. There is an assumption I want to see sharks. It drives me crazy. I tell dive guides, no this is what I want to do and they ignore me. And then are disappointed because I really didn't like their special dive that took me through a channel with a ripping current and absolutely nothing to see.

I wonder how much of this machismo is at work in what we have seen happen not just with this most recent incident but with a lot of incidents in cave and wreck diving. I suppose I could take the attitude that "boys will be boys" and let it go, but it interferes with my enjoyment of the experience. (I started to write sport, but it's not a sport; it's an experience.)