Creating a dive computer with Location and Communications

[Manjula Ellepola]

Spot on Brendon. Time and trials will tell if it is a blue sky dream or a deep blue reality...

 

[Rred]

Yes, but one would hope the IP issues were already secured by patent, if the technology existed. Considering there's been nothing remotely like that advertised or discussed, there would have to be some real radical technology. Not to disparage the OP, but every once in a while I see new claims for radical new solar cell technology...and a home page that always has a "For Investors" tab on it. The technology never gets to market, but the investors sure get harvested. Or the many well-intentioned folks who go on "Shark Tank" only to be told "there's nothing proprietary, the big guys will eat you for lunch"...and other problems.

Communicate while underwater? OK, laser and radio don't carry. That means sonic. Aside from pissing off marine mammals...you've need a powerful transducer, a very sensitive receiver, and some signal processing that exceeds anything the USN or anyone else has in submarines and rescue vehicles. Not impossible, just unlikely that it would exist without being patented very quickly and sold to that "cost doesn't matter" market first.

Same problem with positioning. You certainly could take a GPS reading while on the surface, and use the 3D accelerometers (now dirt cheap and tiny from cell phones, previously kitchen appliance sized at six and seven figures) to maintain some kind of accuracy, but again, a lot of processor power and that's also eluded the markets that would gladly pay for it.

Be nice when and if it can happen but nothing hints that it really can.

 

[RainPilot]

The Aqwary DC already had text messages underwater as well as a buddy finder like the Lynx

 

[dmaziuk]

There's always quantum entanglement...

 

[Rred]

Aqwary DC?
I can't find any trace that they ever got into production, let alone that they claimed any kind of range like the OP is discussing. Or are they just advertising to three-letter agencies?

dm-
You've got it! Now all we have to do is pair our quarks before jumping off the dive boat.(G)

 

[RainPilot]

They demonstrated at DEMA but never got marketing off the ground. My point is that some guys as a hobby built an underwater texting device with OTS components.

The OP is CTO of a company that specialises in underwater comms

DSPComm - Connecting Everything Underwater

If he can build a 4kbps modem with 3km range then underwater texting shouldn't be a huge difference

 

[RonR]

To expand on some of the remarks made by @RainPilot I concure with all of the above I highlighted

Certainly I'd see a benefit of being able to have a direction and distance to my buddy, or the boat. When guiding others, I'd certainly like to be able to see their gas contents, while I carry out checks, I don't find it easy to hold a mental picture of 4 or more pressures

If I'm running dives off the boat, then having a master unit that can interrogate teh units held by the divers would be great. knowing their depth and distance. I'm my location we rely on the divers using a DSMB before they surface. Until that comes up you don't know their precise location.

If I have divers on deco, while I know their plan, but seeing a real time read out of their depth from the boat could be a real boon. The more real time info I could get on the boat, the happier I'd be - If I could get a read of gas pressures and deco times etc onto my master, it would take a lot of guess work out of the equation

And yes some means of surface communication. If a diver gets swept off a site, being able to get a bearing if not distance would be useful, as would some sort of communication from the diver to the boat (even if it's mostly standard messages. Underwater text, not for me as yet, as hand signals are quick, my typing is slow

As mentioned before Liquivision had some of these ideas in one of their products - the lynx

Obviously my wish list is more focused on managing groups of divers, rather than just between a buddy team.

At DEMA Atomic was showing a boat unit that would give vectors, distance and tank pressures for divers who were using the Liquivision acoustic tank transmitters. It sends data to a laptop/ iPad, etc. This could have value for dive operations if all the divers had acoustic tank transmitters such as Liquivision or the upcoming Atomic. I was part of an accident investigation several years back where this would have very probably saved the diver’s life.

Liquivision also had a distance and vector, buddy tank pressure monitoring, and messaging function in the Lynx computer- though it required some practice to use the locator functions. And because divers operate near bottom in an environment with lots of obstructions, acoustic transmission distances can vary a lot, compared to ideal “open water” conditions. Diver to diver use inside caves, wrecks, etc. would be iffy if it’s not line of sight. But if the limitations of previous implementations can be overcome, there its promise.

I was using underwater wireless/ acoustic modem based voice comm systems decades ago, and there are many consumer grade sonar systems available. The challenge is making this practically useable for a diver, which is largely a function of size to power ratio and user interface. I don’t doubt it will happen.

I’d echo some previous comments and advise against trying to build a dive computer on top of this. Engineers tend to think building a dive computer is easy- and it is, somewhat, from a hardware standpoint. But getting the firmware right in a dive computer, particularly with any kind of graphic interface, is really hard. I’ve dealt with several who greatly underestimated the difficulty and the effort required. Unlike an instrument that just sends and processes data, you need to account for all the possible actions a diver could take and make sure you handle each situation appropriately. And because there are strong and distinct markets for certain types of dive computers, you might be limiting your market unnecessarily. A better bet might be to tap into data from an existing computer or tank transmitter. Imagine if there were a standard protocol for acoustic data transmission...

-Ron

 

[Rred]

Heck, maybe it is like "computers". In 1975, you built an air conditioned room with a raised floor to house one. In 1985, you could throw one in a duffel bag. In 1995, you got the same power in the duffel bag that the room sized one had. And in 2015...The damned things still crash. (Which reflects on programmers, not the poor computers.)

I can't help wonder how computer electronics will like residing on the same wrist as high-power ultrasonic transducers. I'm pretty sure that counts as "abusing silicon life forms" and in California they can arrest you for that.(G)

 

[dmaziuk]

A better bet might be to tap into data from an existing computer or tank transmitter. Imagine if there were a standard protocol for acoustic data transmission...

Imagine if PPS published their transmitter protocol and anybody, not just Pelagic and Shearwater, could add AI to their computer line-up.

 

[dmaziuk]

The damned things still crash. (Which reflects on programmers, not the poor computers.)

This reminds me of how, when the CPUs hit the meltdown point with clock frequencies, they turned to "lotsa'n'lotsa cores", and then started blaming programmers for the fact that that was not working "lotsa'n'lotsa fast". And then somehow the stories that "CPUs are great, it's the programmers can't parallel-program" disappeared overnight. My theory is software pushers got together and quietly told the CPU peddlers they can port their warez to other CPU architectures, and in some cases have once or twice already.

They don't crash. You just need to know what you're doing, starting with not buying the cheapest .cn crap you can source.

And speaking of high-powered ultrasonic transducers, could I put one on my belt and have it work on my kidney stone while we're at it?