Dive Computer vs Dive Watch
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dumpsterDiver
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I really do not agree with much of this. A dive computer may actually give a new diver more No-Deco time, but most new divers run out of air before time, so this aspect may be inconsequential for new divers.
Other than running out of air, I think a primary hazard to new divers is too fast of an ascent rate. A dive computer makes it simple to maintain a safe ascent rate. If it gets mad at you, it beeps, blinks and should give a good warning of an accelerated ascent rate. This capability alone provides a significant safety advantage, particularly to new divers.
Some may argue that a diver will learn to control an ascent better with a watch and a analog depth guage, but i would argue the opposite.. the feedback the computer gives will allow an attentive new diver to learn what the correct ascent rate feels like in a shorter time. It is less task loading and just simpler.
I learned old school with a Princeton Tech Timer and depth gage, but I feel the computer is significantly better for a new diver.
It doesn't seem like that long ago that I remember old timers arguing that power inflators on BC's were totally inappropriate for new divers because they would not learn how to work the device and it would actually be more dangerous for them. I think your arguement is also dated.
When I mentioned that scenario, I was thinking of the computer as a tool to determine if you can safely make that detour from the plan. If you don't fully know what the numbers represent or how they're going to change, then you probably shouldn't be going there. It's a tool if you know how to use it as such. I figure that it adds flexibility to the dive plan if you use it before the detour rather than after the detour and asking "ok, computer, now what?" Maybe my dive plans are just more general than maybe they should be and allow for such deviations when I judge them to be safe based on depth, time, gas supply, mod, etc. If I didn't have the tool available to me, then either I would use whatever contingency plans I had or watch from afar. I'm not going to go anywhere that my brain hasn't already been.
freewillie
Contributor
Tools and technology are interesting things. At one point they make life easy, and once you get used to them almost essential. But technology out paces standards so we often find ourselves in uncharted waters - no pun intended.
An ax can help save your life in the woods. It helps build life saving shelter and provides life saving fire. Can you survive without one? Sure, but makes life so much easier. But, if your not careful and don't use it properly you will go missing a body part, maybe even suffer a life threatening injury.
Sound familiar. Dive computers are simply tools that make diving easier and do essentially the same thing as tables but are easier to use and more accurate for the diver. But it is the diver that decides how to use that tool.
I've never seen a computer do multiple deep dives then try and fly in under 24 hours. I've never seen a computer do multiple dives and shorten a surface interval. I've never seen a computer dive with a hang over and not be properly hydrated. All the aforementioned bad behavior has been done by divers but not by a computer.
Divers have been getting bent before there were computers. Using tables back then didnt prevent diver's from pushing NDL's. They just now have a different excuse.
An ax can help save your life in the woods. It helps build life saving shelter and provides life saving fire. Can you survive without one? Sure, but makes life so much easier. But, if your not careful and don't use it properly you will go missing a body part, maybe even suffer a life threatening injury.
Sound familiar. Dive computers are simply tools that make diving easier and do essentially the same thing as tables but are easier to use and more accurate for the diver. But it is the diver that decides how to use that tool.
I've never seen a computer do multiple deep dives then try and fly in under 24 hours. I've never seen a computer do multiple dives and shorten a surface interval. I've never seen a computer dive with a hang over and not be properly hydrated. All the aforementioned bad behavior has been done by divers but not by a computer.
Divers have been getting bent before there were computers. Using tables back then didnt prevent diver's from pushing NDL's. They just now have a different excuse.
Bob DBF
Contributor
Not just new divers. When I first started using a dive computer it was constantly pi**ed at me for my 60' per min ascents, it does let me do them from XXX to 60'. Over time I have learned to slow down and stop the flashing lights and beeps. My daughter and other newer divers have me mostly trained to do a safety stop, and I have become a safer diver due to constant harassment.
Bob
------------------------------------------
I may be old, but I'm not dead yet.
I can only speak for myself, but as a "mature" diver I need something I can actually read underwater! The dive watches I've seen generally suffer from small print. Even many dive computers are difficult to read for me, especially since they cram so much into such a small space. Those still blessed with 20/20 vision may be fine with a dive watch.
DukeAMO
Contributor
I have a slightly different perspective on this as a new diver myself.
For myself, I found that buying the BCD and computer first made sense (after the mask/fin/snorkel/booties). The BCD because I'm a curvy woman and I got really sick of having the BCD up around my neck instead of down on my shoulders. And the dive computer because it makes it much easier to manage my depth so I can focus on other important things (like buoyancy and air consumption). (My computer, BTW, is the Mares Puck, and it was $200. It's not fancy but it works well, and it handles all of the important variables for rec divers.)
I would compare this to learning to drive on a manual or an automatic car, and then driving a manual or automatic car on a daily basis. It's nice to learn how to drive the manual car first, so you'll have those skills, but unless the actual shifting of the car is something that you like to do, it's easier to drive an automatic. Driving an automatic makes it easier for new drivers to focus on other things, like their speed, the road signs, and other cars. That is, until the manual shifting becomes second nature and it's no longer task-loading. I would say using a dive computer is similar to driving an automatic car.
Ascents are the biggie for me. *Especially* if you're a new diver in cold water, which you and I are. You're wearing lots of neoprene that expands, weights to compensate for the neoprene on the surface, and extra air in the BC to compensate for the weights at depth. It's easy to get into an unplanned or faster than planned ascent when the neoprene and air start to expand on you, even if you just take too deep of a breath, or if you're looking at your compass and don't realize you're swimming up a bit. If you're not wearing a computer, it may take you 10 or more seconds to figure out exactly what's going on. You'll look around and wonder why something seems wrong. Then you'll fish around your waist for your console. It'll be upside down so you'll flip it over. Then you'll watch the little indicator slowly moving counter-clockwise. "Oh, I'm ascending too fast!" Then you drop the console and grab your deflator because they're on the same side. By then you may be getting into the danger zone, and at least hurting your ears. And now you have to re-descend under control, without a line, without looking at your depth gauge, because you're holding the deflator instead of the depth gauge. Good luck with that as a new diver!
The computer, on the other hand, will quickly start beeping at you. You can look at it, and within a second or two you'll notice that your depth indicator is changing (30, 29, 28). It'll also have an indicator saying "SLOW DOWN". You should wear the computer on your right hand so you can grab the BCD deflator at the same time. Then you can use the computer's depth indicator to help stop your ascent and do a controlled re-descent, even if you're lacking visual queues or a line.
The computer is also extremely helpful for managing the 3-minute safety stop. It'll remind you to do the stop, count down the 3 minutes for you, pause the countdown if you stray out of the right depth range, resume it when you get back in range, and put a nastygram in your dive log if you missed it (or if you ascended too fast). Call it constructive feedback.
When you finally do buy more gear, you won't have to buy a console depth gauge. You can just put an air gauge on your console (and optionally the compass, but I prefer a wrist compass). In the unlikely event that your computer dies in the middle of a dive, your dive day may be over if you haven't logged your previous dives yet, but you can use the other info you still have (total time, max depth, maybe your buddy's computer data) to log that dive as if you were using the RDP.
I'm also a little flaky when diving, because I get all excited, and I have a tendency to forget the time I started the descent, started the ascent, and returned to the surface. The dive computer remembers the start time and total time for me. Plus the surface temperature and bottom temperature, which is nice to know.
I can still calculate dives using the RDP, no problem, and I usually log the dive both ways for practice and backup information. But boy is life simpler with the computer!
One other point to mention - computer rentals are very expensive. After about 10 dives you'll have paid for the computer in rental fees.
Oh, and it makes navigation easier if you can hold your compass with one hand/wrist and have your depth gauge on the other wrist, so you can watch both at the same time! If you have them both on the console, on opposite sides, that's impossible. When DH and I were learning navigation, monitoring our depth at the same time was the trickiest part.
For myself, I found that buying the BCD and computer first made sense (after the mask/fin/snorkel/booties). The BCD because I'm a curvy woman and I got really sick of having the BCD up around my neck instead of down on my shoulders. And the dive computer because it makes it much easier to manage my depth so I can focus on other important things (like buoyancy and air consumption). (My computer, BTW, is the Mares Puck, and it was $200. It's not fancy but it works well, and it handles all of the important variables for rec divers.)
I would compare this to learning to drive on a manual or an automatic car, and then driving a manual or automatic car on a daily basis. It's nice to learn how to drive the manual car first, so you'll have those skills, but unless the actual shifting of the car is something that you like to do, it's easier to drive an automatic. Driving an automatic makes it easier for new drivers to focus on other things, like their speed, the road signs, and other cars. That is, until the manual shifting becomes second nature and it's no longer task-loading. I would say using a dive computer is similar to driving an automatic car.
Ascents are the biggie for me. *Especially* if you're a new diver in cold water, which you and I are. You're wearing lots of neoprene that expands, weights to compensate for the neoprene on the surface, and extra air in the BC to compensate for the weights at depth. It's easy to get into an unplanned or faster than planned ascent when the neoprene and air start to expand on you, even if you just take too deep of a breath, or if you're looking at your compass and don't realize you're swimming up a bit. If you're not wearing a computer, it may take you 10 or more seconds to figure out exactly what's going on. You'll look around and wonder why something seems wrong. Then you'll fish around your waist for your console. It'll be upside down so you'll flip it over. Then you'll watch the little indicator slowly moving counter-clockwise. "Oh, I'm ascending too fast!" Then you drop the console and grab your deflator because they're on the same side. By then you may be getting into the danger zone, and at least hurting your ears. And now you have to re-descend under control, without a line, without looking at your depth gauge, because you're holding the deflator instead of the depth gauge. Good luck with that as a new diver!
The computer, on the other hand, will quickly start beeping at you. You can look at it, and within a second or two you'll notice that your depth indicator is changing (30, 29, 28). It'll also have an indicator saying "SLOW DOWN". You should wear the computer on your right hand so you can grab the BCD deflator at the same time. Then you can use the computer's depth indicator to help stop your ascent and do a controlled re-descent, even if you're lacking visual queues or a line.
The computer is also extremely helpful for managing the 3-minute safety stop. It'll remind you to do the stop, count down the 3 minutes for you, pause the countdown if you stray out of the right depth range, resume it when you get back in range, and put a nastygram in your dive log if you missed it (or if you ascended too fast). Call it constructive feedback.
When you finally do buy more gear, you won't have to buy a console depth gauge. You can just put an air gauge on your console (and optionally the compass, but I prefer a wrist compass). In the unlikely event that your computer dies in the middle of a dive, your dive day may be over if you haven't logged your previous dives yet, but you can use the other info you still have (total time, max depth, maybe your buddy's computer data) to log that dive as if you were using the RDP.
I'm also a little flaky when diving, because I get all excited, and I have a tendency to forget the time I started the descent, started the ascent, and returned to the surface. The dive computer remembers the start time and total time for me. Plus the surface temperature and bottom temperature, which is nice to know.
I can still calculate dives using the RDP, no problem, and I usually log the dive both ways for practice and backup information. But boy is life simpler with the computer!
One other point to mention - computer rentals are very expensive. After about 10 dives you'll have paid for the computer in rental fees.
Oh, and it makes navigation easier if you can hold your compass with one hand/wrist and have your depth gauge on the other wrist, so you can watch both at the same time! If you have them both on the console, on opposite sides, that's impossible. When DH and I were learning navigation, monitoring our depth at the same time was the trickiest part.
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dive-comp-wiz
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G'day, guys!
I still prefer diving with computer and still having my dive tables with me. Of course, I'm risking that dive computer will go kaput on me. Maybe I just became lazy to calculate NDLs as I did long time ago?
And your idea of writing your NDLs using marker on your wet suit arm - that's a good idea!
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