Dive Master... why are instructors pressing for it?

[dmmike]

OK, I guess I have to ring in one more time. The more I continue to read this thread the more concerned I get. I have been following the "comparison" of differnt agency teaching methods and information covered. The dive master course is like anything else in life you get out of it what you put into it. My DM and AI are both PADI, but when I undertook them I knew the instructor that I was going to "study" under would unvail an entire new understanding and level of knowledge. Maybe I was lucky I had such a motivated teacher or maybe he understood that I wanted more from the course than just the "black card". Yes, I was "courted" for a period of time before I took the next step and made it clear that I would not "go to the next level" until I had complete comand of each level of skill. The instructor I had always "de-briefed" me after each pool session and told me what I needed to improve or a method that may work better. Its been several years that I have worked with him and he still does this to this day. He also gives me the most "difficult" students to work with so I can continue to improve my skill base. What he continues to tell me is to work with as many different instructors as possible and take only the best from each to develop my own style. So back to the point, when becoming a DM ask what the instructor is going to provide above and beyond the class and pool. If the answer to that question is "very little" find somebody else to study under. Like I said before you will get out of it what you put into it, regardless of the agency. If you feel you want to help then this is one method to do it.

 

[Mako Mark]

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[RP Diver]

I can't speak for other instructors out there but I am pretty selective about who I ask to go on. Usually it will be 3-4 people every two years that we ask and it is usually people who hang around a lot, are good with people and usually want to go on to become instructors.

I took it as a high compliment when my Rescue instructor took me aside and recommended that I go on to DM. IMO, that goes beyond the company line of promoting con-ed and tells me that he thinks I have the potential to be a DM that HE would like to have working with him. I never knew of an instructor at my dive shop that made a blanket offer for the DM class, because any DM trained there was likely to end up working in future classes with that instructor. With rare exceptions, the DM's and instructors were randomly assigned to the various classes, so you never knew who you might get paired with. No instructor worth his c-card wants to be saddled with a DM that he has to babysit. Quite to the contrary, he more likely expects the DM to take some of that off his hands by focusing on problem students, thereby freeing up the instructor to work with the class as a whole.

It may be a different situation if you haven't established an ongoing relationship with a particular LDS, or if you are taking classes away from home and the instructor doesn't expect to ever see you again. But my experience was with a single dive shop, and one that is highly rated for turning out quality divers at all levels.

 

[likelite]

Y'all think PADI DM is a cakewalk?? I'm about to fall over in my seat laughing...or maybe, based on what I've read here, there are some shops that are really crummy in their course instruction.

I have a Master Trainer that's tip-top. We don't get signed off until we know that material - I mean really know it, not just parrot platitudes. I've done the pressure/volume equation till I could just cry. I don't think I've ever done anything so challenging in my life, and I've held job titles that impress some people (and went to college, got good grades, etc.)

Sheesh. Yeah, the more I read, the more I think my dive shop is one of the rare exceptions. I'm lucky to have 'em.

 

[oceancrest67]

Y'all think PADI DM is a cakewalk?? I'm about to fall over in my seat laughing...or maybe, based on what I've read here, there are some shops that are really crummy in their course instruction.

I have a Master Trainer that's tip-top. We don't get signed off until we know that material - I mean really know it, not just parrot platitudes. I've done the pressure/volume equation till I could just cry. I don't think I've ever done anything so challenging in my life, and I've held job titles that impress some people (and went to college, got good grades, etc.)

Sheesh. Yeah, the more I read, the more I think my dive shop is one of the rare exceptions. I'm lucky to have 'em.

I am cynical enough to say that most instructors are not tip top and average divers at best. I know old guard open water divers (diving for years) that are much better divers than some newly certified instructor. My dive master certification was hard enough but I was disappointed in my instructor (arrogant, fat and lazy). I had to chase after other instructors to get things done.

 

[ghostdiver1957]

This weekend I was completing my rescue course and I sort of found it odd that the three instructors I was with asked me to become a dive master. Feeling all proud that I must be a good diver I took that warm and fuzzy feeling to bed with me. The next day, I noticed that they also said that to the other two guys in my group. So this got me to thinking... why would all the instructors ask their students to become dive masters?

I know it doesn't pay well, if at all. Here in Colorado, you really don't dive in great places. What's in it for the instructors? Other than they have a grunt doing the **** work?

The second part of this debate would be... if the bonus to having me as a dive master is for them... does that mean I'm in a position to negotiate on cost of training or gear?

Are you kidding?

Because the shop owners have told the Instructors to SELL SELL SELL classes. They don't need Dive Masters... they need your dollars. They may even be getting commissions on the classes they sell you. You may very well be ready to be a dive master in their opinion... but believe me... that's not what it's about.

A recent article written by Doug McNeese, Executive Director of SSI states that the number of Open Water Divers being certified has declined each year since 2001. This means less new divers to sell classes too... so they need to sell more classes to those already certified in an attempt to make money.

The same article also admits that the dumbing down of the classes has begun to take effect. Divers who have been getting Open Water certfied by SSI, PADI and others are not comfortable in the water... so they aren't being retained. This is why Scuba equipment sales are down, why dive travel is down and why 424 Scuba Shops went out of business in 2004 alone. The numbers aren't in yet for 2005, but the decline is getting worse.

Don't be suckered in by this crap... tell them where to stick it... and go enjoy diving.

 

[countryboy]

You need to look at who is being asked to become DM's. Do you see them as having great skills? Are they up to the level YOU would expect to see coming from a future DM?

If the answer to either of these is NO, then they are selling cards / classes.. If the people in the DM class (are being offered the DM class) have not exhibited "top notch" capabilities.. then it is just a way for the instructor / shop to fill the classes.

In some DM classes I saw people that did not do the homework, barely studied, couldn't maintain buoyancy, etc.. They passed (just about everyone does)..

I needed to step back and take inventory of my own skills .. Was I really as good as I thought I was? Being told I was? Some things yes, some no.. Harsh reality.

I have since started taking classes from a different place. Diving with people outside of my normal realm. I am doing what I need to for myself.. I do not regret taking the DM class because I really put a lot of effort into it..

You need to determine the quality of training the instructor / shop is performing. Are they instructing at the highest levels? Unfortunately, you do not know what you don't know.. Audit a different shops class, see how they compare. You need to put the effort in your future. Then decide your direction.

 

[bubblemonkey]

alot of the posts on this thread seem to point in the direction of "they need more grunts to do the lifting and carrying" this time next year i shall be doing my DMT and the place i am doing it have no hiarchy yes the DMs set up the tanks in the morning and keep the palce clean and sand free, clean the wash tanks etc, but if there are instructors there they do it as well, the instructors set up their own students gear etc.
Once my DMT is complete i may decide to do my IDC maybe not as we will be wanting to move on by then, but if you get to a place and find a dive shop wanting a DMT suss them out first exactly what they exspect from a DM first, at the end of the day as a working DM its not like you are contracted to work somewhere if you dont like it, where there is one dive shop there is always another.

 

[countryboy]

.... as a working DM its not like you are contracted to work somewhere if you dont like it, where there is one dive shop there is always another.

If you purchase your insurance through the shop, they *may* limit you to only performing DM activities through them...

 

[craborn]

If I have students that are finishing Rescue and I think they are good enough to be a dive master I would ask all of them if not I may just ask some of them. Being a Dive Master is an honor that you are a good enough diver and person. I also want my divers to become a DM so they will continue diving and hang around with us. Our dive shop is a family. Please come dive with us. Clay