Diver dies in San Diego

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

My heart goes out to the family and even more to the son.

This really should send home the message of doing a refresher course before jumping back in the water. Although it may not stop someone from doing something stupid, it could and should remind them of what NOT to do.... like go down to 160fsw with an Al80 tank.

Had a guy at the dive shop a few weeks back wanna rent gear and after talking a bit to him, come to find out, hadn't dove in nearly 20 years..... sorry, cant rent to you.
 
My heart goes out to the family and even more to the son.

This really should send home the message of doing a refresher course before jumping back in the water. Although it may not stop someone from doing something stupid, it could and should remind them of what NOT to do.... like go down to 160fsw with an Al80 tank.


I TOTALLY agree !! If there has been a large time lapse in your diving OR if you are diving in a new environment, hire a DM/Instructor to do a refresher or area orientation!! Money well spent. As us So Cal divers know, not all diving experience is the same. When I travel, I try to find a good DM, they will show me the cool little critters I'd never have seen because it's not my usual dive spot. (I'd have NEVER seen that frog fish in Hawaii or the hidding sea horse in Greece!!)

For those that need the help due to inexperience, that hired DM could save their lives.
 
For those that need the help due to inexperience, that hired DM could save their lives.

I dont believe for 1 second that any DM or instructor would let a person go to 150fsw without proper training. I know I wouldn't.
 
Last edited:
What scares the heck out of me is that there are way too many people out there that defend this sort of action. I have had words with some individuals on other threads here where DM's in Hawaii were taking new divers to 140+ feet (two different people recently on two different threads - eg. # 1 and eg. # 2). This is far from 200 feet but these people defend the DM's saying that "....they must have assessed the diver's skills and decided they were safe to go that deep....". Complete nonsense in my opinion and I wish there was a way to prevent DM's from doing it. The rules (or guidelines or whatever you want to call them) are in place for a reason. If you wish to go deeper, further your training. If you want to do it on your own.....you are your own judge of common sense (a failed judge at that). IMNSHO a DM should have their credentials pulled the first time they knowingly do that. If needed, a shop can have two DM's (1 for AOW and 1 for OW) to keep people happy OR I would personally rather dive a 59' deep reef and keep everybody within their limits....and I somehow doubt I am the only person that feels this way.
 
I'm not so sure I believe that they went to 160 ft. Without computer data or a firsthand account from the son, you just can't know for sure. It's too easy to speculate that they went down the buoy line to 130 ft as they had apparently planned, got low on air and started heading up. That would still allow for the father to go dry at 60 ft and the son to go dry at 40 ft. The son makes it to the surface, but the father does not...resulting in his body being found at 160 ft.

I guess it may not make that much difference, but the particulars are important to me. Also, with several friends that are DM's, I know that all of them preach safety to the max. This was an accident waiting to happen regardless.
 
,.....Also, with several friends that are DM's, I know that all of them preach safety to the max. This was an accident waiting to happen regardless.

I definitley say that most DM's are safe and operate themselves in safe manners. I defintiely did not mean to say or imply that most do not. I am sure hey do. In this case, the divers were without a DM so it really does not apply here. My point was, there are too many people that will go out of there way to defend those DM's that do not preach safety (or do not parctice safety is more accurate) and that the DM's should be dealt with somehow if they knowingly break the rules.

In this case, if they planned 130' (which it sounds like was planned), it really was an overly aggressive dive plan for a couple of divers that had not been out in a couple years. This, sounds like (the true facts could prove otherwise if they ever come out) just a bad decision gone very wrong.
 
:no:

What scares the heck out of me is that there are way too many people out there that defend this sort of action. I have had words with some individuals on other threads here where DM's in Hawaii were taking new divers to 140+ feet (two different people recently on two different threads - eg. # 1 and eg. # 2). This is far from 200 feet but these people defend the DM's saying that "....they must have assessed the diver's skills and decided they were safe to go that deep....". Complete nonsense in my opinion and I wish there was a way to prevent DM's from doing it. The rules (or guidelines or whatever you want to call them) are in place for a reason. If you wish to go deeper, further your training. If you want to do it on your own.....you are your own judge of common sense (a failed judge at that). IMNSHO a DM should have their credentials pulled the first time they knowingly do that. If needed, a shop can have two DM's (1 for AOW and 1 for OW) to keep people happy OR I would personally rather dive a 59' deep reef and keep everybody within their limits....and I somehow doubt I am the only person that feels this way.

Most if not all certifying agencies have a "Quality Management Department" that monitors the quality of their programs. Their job is to check that their Instructors, AI, and DMs to ensure they comply with standards while conducting their services. Some provide guidance and correction when errors turn up. Punitive measures (suspension and expulsion) result from blatant refusal to follow standards and corrective measures.

Please check the link below for examples of one of the certifying agencies that take these types of concerns very serious.

Quality Management Report

ScubaSteve001 you are right on the money… dive professional not taking safety seriously should be dealt with accordingly. This event definitely shines a light into a number of things we can do better to make diving fun and safe. I personally applaud those divers that sign up for a scuba tune-up after a few months on inactivity. If they divers in this tragedy would have taken the sport serious we would be discusing politics or how bad the chargers played this last weekend.

Safe Diving…
 
I'm not so sure I believe that they went to 160 ft. Without computer data or a firsthand account from the son, you just can't know for sure. It's too easy to speculate that they went down the buoy line to 130 ft as they had apparently planned, got low on air and started heading up. That would still allow for the father to go dry at 60 ft and the son to go dry at 40 ft. The son makes it to the surface, but the father does not...resulting in his body being found at 160 ft.
Based on Lifeguard quotes of what the son was saying and the consistency of the media coverage with regard to this detail, I think it's reasonable to say that the buddy pair planned a dive to a max depth of 130 fsw. The son was quoted as saying that they were down at 150 fsw. Sources within the Lifeguard/Fire & Rescue ranks, who have access to the equipment of both divers involved, state that their max depth was 161 fsw. I don't think these professionals pulled "161" out of thin air. I agree, though, that it would be nice for them to report that the dive profile was downloaded from one or both of their computers...or something to that effect.

Until now, I have been loathe to speculate as to what happened. I think I'm willing to stick my neck out on this one...since doing so may move the discussion forward. I, too, agree that going through "what-ifs" might help us be more prepared in the future.

Here is what I think may have happened:

If they did descend on the buoyline that is located at 120 fsw, I speculate that they strayed from the line, recognized they were short on air, initiated a blue water ascent, and then began to share air once the father ran out of air completely. Being inexperienced divers with limited air-sharing practice, it's likely that each diver wasn't managing his buoyancy independently. By "managing," I mean aiming for independently near-neutral buoyancy. During ascent, it's possible that the son felt "heavy" and added air to his BCD. At the same time, it's also possible that the father was dumping air...perhaps too quickly to remain neutrally buoyant. Together they may have been ascending at a safe rate. At some point, the two became separated. It's not surprising that once they let go of each other, one went up to the surface (narrowly escaping AGE or lung overexpansion injury) and the other went down. With no air left in his tank to inflate his BCD, the father's only option would have been to orally inflate it...which would have been dependent upon the amount of air he had left in his lungs. With additional wetsuit compression as his depth increased, his buoyancy would have become increasingly negative. It is entirely possible that he was overweighted to begin with and, for some reason (possibly narcosis and/or panic), he was unable/or did not think to ditch his weights.

Again, I hope that the son and family do not view this "what-if" scenario as a finger-pointing session. That's not my intention at all. Both divers were very inexperienced. Neither intended for the dive to turn out the way it did. Once they recognized they were in trouble, I have no doubt that they fought with every ounce of their being to survive. They cooperated to share air and to see each other through the incident. Unfortunately, too many factors were stacked up against them. The son is very fortunate to be alive. I hope that the Lifeguards and investigating authorities will release more facts surrounding the incident as they become available. I also hope that, at some point, the son will share his account of the incident with the diving community.
 
Last edited:
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/

Back
Top Bottom