Diving Resistant to Change?
- Thread starter Ioncloud9
- Start date
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
TrimixToo
Contributor
As others have observed, for some kinds of dive gear there seems little room for improvement.
A while back, I was riding my bike on Long Island. I was on my 90's Cannondale touring frame, with its Brooks saddle, Suntour gears, bar-end shifters, Look clipless pedals, and such. Another cyclist began to ride alongside, and we slowed so we could talk. He said newer bicycles were demonstrably more efficient as he surveyed my tried-and-true 'dale, based on an article he'd read in Bicycling or some such about measurements made using the same riders on different bikes. The article apparently said you could pick up nearly 1mph if you bought something new and shiny.
I thought to myself, but did not say, that my conditioning has a lot more to do with my average speed than my bike. These days I'm doing well to average 15-16 mph in hilly terrain. When I commuted by bike, riding 3000-5000 miles a year, I averaged 20-21 mph to work and back. The very latest $10K carbon finder wunder-bike would not make up that difference. Also, my 'dales are rock-solid reliable. A nick in one of my forks does not force a $400 replacement. I'm a recreational cyclist, not a top-tier racer. I'll keep my 'dales, and they'll probably outlast me.
So it goes with diving. For many bits of kit, your conditioning and technique will make a bigger difference than your gear.
Like others who have posted, I learned to dive a long time ago. The changes since then have been substantial in some ways, but many things are basically unchanged because, as others have said, there just isn't much room for For improvement any more. For example, gas physics being what they are, regulators can only do so much. My son's pony reg is the one I bought new in 1972. It breathes nearly as well as a more modern high-performance reg, and every bit as well as his mid-tier but much newer reg.
But these power inflator thingies? Hey, they're really cool! Not to mention dive computers, better dry suits and insulation, isolation manifolds, incredibly bright and efficient underwater lights, and such that I use now all the time, none of which existed (as far as I know) when I learned to dive. And deco theory and practice have advanced hugely. Advancing from USN dive tables to using tools like Multi-Deco for planning and Shearwater computers in the water, we can spend far less time on deco with far greater (though still not perfect) safety than we ever have had before for mixed-gas deep diving.
Changes like these, I welcome.
A while back, I was riding my bike on Long Island. I was on my 90's Cannondale touring frame, with its Brooks saddle, Suntour gears, bar-end shifters, Look clipless pedals, and such. Another cyclist began to ride alongside, and we slowed so we could talk. He said newer bicycles were demonstrably more efficient as he surveyed my tried-and-true 'dale, based on an article he'd read in Bicycling or some such about measurements made using the same riders on different bikes. The article apparently said you could pick up nearly 1mph if you bought something new and shiny.
I thought to myself, but did not say, that my conditioning has a lot more to do with my average speed than my bike. These days I'm doing well to average 15-16 mph in hilly terrain. When I commuted by bike, riding 3000-5000 miles a year, I averaged 20-21 mph to work and back. The very latest $10K carbon finder wunder-bike would not make up that difference. Also, my 'dales are rock-solid reliable. A nick in one of my forks does not force a $400 replacement. I'm a recreational cyclist, not a top-tier racer. I'll keep my 'dales, and they'll probably outlast me.
So it goes with diving. For many bits of kit, your conditioning and technique will make a bigger difference than your gear.
Like others who have posted, I learned to dive a long time ago. The changes since then have been substantial in some ways, but many things are basically unchanged because, as others have said, there just isn't much room for For improvement any more. For example, gas physics being what they are, regulators can only do so much. My son's pony reg is the one I bought new in 1972. It breathes nearly as well as a more modern high-performance reg, and every bit as well as his mid-tier but much newer reg.
But these power inflator thingies? Hey, they're really cool! Not to mention dive computers, better dry suits and insulation, isolation manifolds, incredibly bright and efficient underwater lights, and such that I use now all the time, none of which existed (as far as I know) when I learned to dive. And deco theory and practice have advanced hugely. Advancing from USN dive tables to using tools like Multi-Deco for planning and Shearwater computers in the water, we can spend far less time on deco with far greater (though still not perfect) safety than we ever have had before for mixed-gas deep diving.
Changes like these, I welcome.
Yeah, I don't really see scuba diving being resistant to change, but I can see how someone might think so. Not too many other activities include so many things that your very life depends on. This makes things a little different than say computer gaming. It's not that scuba diving is resistant or unable to change as much, it's more that the changes that do take place usually have to involve some measure of caution that the change wont create some problem down the road. Every change or new idea has to be vetted through this big tough safety monster, and he rejects anything that could possibly be unsafe.
Every activity has it's own level of "must work right" and that means a failure can have drastically different results......computer gaming has a crash some grown man will probably sit a cry for a few hours then go by a new one. Camping, you might get wet or cold and be miserable, but if a regulator locks up at 120 feet??? Well, you look like an octopus. Big brown cloud in the water and you jetting for the surface!!!! Has it's own special way of helping you forget the little things in life.
Every activity has it's own level of "must work right" and that means a failure can have drastically different results......computer gaming has a crash some grown man will probably sit a cry for a few hours then go by a new one. Camping, you might get wet or cold and be miserable, but if a regulator locks up at 120 feet??? Well, you look like an octopus. Big brown cloud in the water and you jetting for the surface!!!! Has it's own special way of helping you forget the little things in life.
60plus
Contributor
I have experience of Motorcycle trials, Motocross, Grasstrack, Karting, shooting, fishing and canoeing. In nearly all these improvements in materials has proved beneficial. However in nearly all these increasing complexity has resulted in increased costs and made repair more difficult. The net result is less people participating.
What I would like to see for scuba is custom build at near standard prices, so you can choose the exact size and features you need. At least one car manufacturer offers this "design your own car option".
What I would like to see for scuba is custom build at near standard prices, so you can choose the exact size and features you need. At least one car manufacturer offers this "design your own car option".
kafkaland
Contributor
What? Adding a cappuccino maker to a regulator wouldn't help the dive? Just imagine, if you could simply hit the brew button way back in that cave, before you start the long swim home. Or, when you're getting cold and tired on that deco hang...
AfterDark
Contributor
Just read the entire thread very interesting. Being an old bold diver starting his 50th year underwater and a senior tech at Dell/EMC for 20 years I can say with confidence that diving is not resistant to change at all. Like Sam Miller and others posting here we have seen many changes over the years. Not only in equipment but in diving styles. The use of ones hands while swimming underwater was very common in 1968 for example. Well that has changed! 
In 1970 nitrox wasn't in use among rec divers. Only commercial and Navy dives used anything but air in OC. Has anybody seen the collapsible, folding, portable recompression chambers? One or two guys can carry it. I can assure you those were not in use in 1970!
Comparing dive gear than and now shows lots of changes. My old SP regs are made of chrome plated brass. I still use them today. How many plastic regs will still be in use 50 years from now? The gear of the past was made mostly from metals today plastic is the king. Be careful what you ask for, not all change is good.
In 1970 nitrox wasn't in use among rec divers. Only commercial and Navy dives used anything but air in OC. Has anybody seen the collapsible, folding, portable recompression chambers? One or two guys can carry it. I can assure you those were not in use in 1970!Comparing dive gear than and now shows lots of changes. My old SP regs are made of chrome plated brass. I still use them today. How many plastic regs will still be in use 50 years from now? The gear of the past was made mostly from metals today plastic is the king. Be careful what you ask for, not all change is good.
The same thing could be said about cars. The 4 wheels, seats facing forward, a steering wheel and pedals design is 100 years old. Why do we keep using it? Because it works.
But just because the basic design hasn't changed doesn't mean the technology hasn't improved. Regulators are the same: a few valves to regulate the pressure of the air you're breathing... the basic design hasn't changed in 50 years, but the technology has improved.
There's also a huge advantage to keeping the system simple, as there are fewer possible failure points than with a complicated system... very important when the purpose of the system is to keep you alive. As an IT guy, you have to admit that you wouldn't want a regulator to be as "buggy" as typical modern software systems.
dead dog
Contributor
Moore's Law level game changes...If a little bit is good, and more is better, then too much is just right. lol
Similar threads
