Equinox Housing for Canon HV30

[brucedd]

BEWARE the Equinox HD 6 housing for the Canon HV30. I bought this with the monitor back and a significant amount of other accessories from B&H Photo and it is mis-engineered such that the monitor mounting screw on the monitorback contacts the camera mounting tray. Although it appears to have sealed, the above mentioned contact prevents a watertight seal and the housing floods.

My Cam is gone never having made it past the dive boat camera bucket in 2' of fresh water.

Niether Equinox nor B&H have done the right thing in this instance and should be considered not to be diver-friendly in the least.

I will be posting a detailed description of the issue with pics and video very soon, in hopes that no one else has to experience what these two vendors have put me through.

Please use vendors more diver freindly and with any reasonable degree of customer service.

B&H all but walked away from the issue, and Equinox (after calling them long distance at more expense to me, no 800 number), promised a return shipping label via email so they could analyse the failure. I never heard back from them. Four follow-up emails have received no reply whatsoever.

I am $3000 poorer due to poor manufacturing and even worse customer service. I lost the opportunity to video my son's graduation dive trip, and I have an expensive Pelican case full of unusable garbage.

Thanks Equinox and B&H! NOT!

PLEASE DO NOT BUY EQUINOX PRODUCTS OR ANYTHING AT ALL FROM B&H PHOTO!

I am happy to share the details with anyone interested in knowing more, and will reply to any questions on this forum or elsewhere.

brucedd
bruce.dedivitis@gmail.com

 

[henryp]

B&H regret's Bruce's dissatisfaction and I sympathize with his disappointment. I have e-mailed Equinox asking them to contact him as he says they promised to do. It is possible their emails to him were waylaid by a spam filter, of course.

B&H certainly did not walk away from the issue. Our return policy is quite specific and clearly states, "No Return/Exchange On ... Underwater equipment that has been submerged." We directed Bruce to Equinox as was appropriate under the circumstances.

It's also worth noting that Bruce's complaint is the only one we've received for this housing all year. The other approximately 2 dozen customers have registered no complaints with us whatsoever.

We ARE sorry for the situation, but I do not feel we deserve this disapprobation.

 

[Equinox Housings]

Dear Sir,

We are very sorry to hear about the issue of that you had, I was the one that you spoke to on the phone and told you that we would be more than happy to bring your unit back for evaluation and if it was a manufacturers defect then we would be more than happy to replace all underwater equipment at no cost to you.

I must admit I am a bit confused, all email come directly to me and our 800 number works perfectly.

We offer the longest and best warranty in the industry and we stand behind our product 100% and in an act of good faith we offered to pay for shipping before we even know if it was a manufacturing issue. (who does this.....no one but us!)

Anytime a flooding occurs it is a very unfortunate situation and very frustrating I know, but please know that from our conversation on the phone the issues do get resolved but sometimes this process takes a couple weeks as opposed to a couple days.

I feel confident in saying that the Equinox housings has the best success rate in the industry for keeping divers cameras dry. In 14 years the Equinox Housing has had under 5 occurrences where it was a manufacturing issue. When it was a manufacturing issues the units were replaced with no questions asked after an evaluation.

It is a very frustrating time I am sure, but please know we do not want housings on the market that do not work and to assume so is a bit ridiculous.

We stand behind the product and always have and once again if it is our fault your underwater equipment will be replaced at no charge to you.

Hell if you want call collect. 269.381.2101 (please just this customer!)

I hope once this issue gets finalized you will show the same vigor in your postings about how we took care of our customer and did the right thing. We all deal with warranty issues and they do take time but before you blast 2 quality and good intentioned companies that believe reputation is important lets let the process happen.

The key to a good company to work with is one that will stand behind their product, we do that.

Best regards,

Sam
Equinox Housings

 

[brucedd]

Nice replies guys, I think there could be places for both of you on the Obama campaign staff. Great spin control. Now how about some action?

FIRST B&H
========
B&H NEVER supplied their return policy or the other terms and conditions they NOW quote well after the deal was made. Unfortunately, the transaction is consummated upon consideration, and B&H had my money well before they ever disclosed the "surprise" Ts & Cs. Thus the deal was made WITHOUT those terms and conditions in effect.

Can I add some of my own Terms and Conditions after the fact too? Hmmm, gee, if this equipment sucks, and the customer service people I have to deal with are complete idiots, you refund me 10 times my cost. There I said that too, does that make it so after the fact? Not likely. Won't work for you either.

But I may just get actual costs plus damages due to detrimental reliance on your representations. If you force me to keep this equipment and just replace the housing so it now works as you represented, I am sure you won't mind flying me and my son back down to the Bahamas for 10 days so I can film this special event with equipment that actually works as represented? If not, I want the cash and interest back, and I will buy current equipment next year before my next dive trip.

The Terms and Conditions appear on the back of the shipping receipts that were sent when B&H shipped the order (more than a week after they had my money). They were NOT on the emailed quote. They were NOT on the emailed order confirmation. These Ts & Cs were not mentioned on the phone. They did of course have time to sell quite a number of additional accessories that I now have no use for. Does that help clarify B&H's priorities? Dollars before all else.

B&H sent me to (this is a quote from their customer service email):
At this point you need to contact both manufacturers and see how to have your specific requests fulfilled.
Equinox (Distributed By - Wet n Rugged) Web: Wet n Rugged - SCUBA, Kayaks, Travel, Underwater Photo Phone: 269-381-2101
Canon Web: Canon U.S.A Phone: 800-828-4040 or 800-652-2666

When I specifically asked B&H for an Equinox 800 number I was told there was not one. I asked that B&H have Equinox call me. I was told I HAD to call those numbers. I did, Sam says I spoke to him, but I never got anything other than an auto reply in return. I will post those emails in my detailed post with the video clip of the housing / monitor back seal you can slide a nickel through.

B&H can try to defend their actions, but I am absolutely certain that Henry Posner has not reviewed the actual history of this issue. And when (if) he or someone beyond level 1 customer service does they will sugarcoat some nice reply so more suckers like me get taken. Thus far, not a single person at B&H that has ANY clue about underwater video equipment has engaged the issue.

B&H will only consider the return of the housing. The monitor back (the other half of the problem) will not be refunded. Why? NO explanation from B&H customer support. I asked, they said, no, only the housing. Henry claims no one else has had an issue with these housings. Has anyone else used this housing with the monitor back? Try apples to apples Henry.

B&H will not refund the spare battery for the monitor back. None of the other accessories that I now have no use for will be refunded either. A huge pelican case to fit a housing I will not own is mine forever for a not so small price? This is fair? Do you ever want to be treated like this?

B&H sold the PACKAGE of the cam and the housing with the representation that it was water proof to 200' (250' in some representations). It was not the least bit waterproof, thus the representation might be considered fraud unless they refund my ENTIRE purchase.

My documented messages regarding this purchase clearly explain to B&H that this was an “everything or nothing” transaction. I needed all parts on time for this trip, or none. B&H knew those terms, and chose to continue the transaction. Thus if the housing is to be refunded, the entire purchase must be.

My attorney is already reviewing this, and has very little doubt of the outcome. I believe upon reviewing the many many pages of documentation, "unassailable" was the term he used. He had also advised me to allow B&H reasonable opportunity to make this right without such a course of action necessary. I think the weeks I have given B&H is more than reasonable. I have requested contact information for the B&H legal department four separate times, and this request continues to be completely ignored.

Henry, you should short circuit this and call me directly to genuinely attempt to resolve this issue. I notice you want everyone else to do that for you.

EQUINOX
=======
Sam, if you are the person I spoke to on the phone as your post states, where is my return shipping label? Or ANY response from you via normal channels for that matter? I gave you my email and my phone contact numbers. Do people have to publicly air their grievance in an agitated manner to get a reply from you?

Oh yeah, the spam filter got the replies...interesting that the auto spam Equinox reply managed to get here. For the record, there is nothing from you in my SPAM folder either.

I never said you want housings that do not work on the market. But you have done nothing to correct the issue since I contacted you on June 25th.

This is a joke. If B&H did the right thing, they would refund my money, and deal with THEIR suppliers after the fact. Now we get to involve the attorneys and add a ridiculous amount of additional time and cost.

Be advised, this will not end until I have my entire purchase price plus interest accrued refunded at a minimum.

Bruce DeDivitis
bruce.dedivitis@gmail.com

 

[henryp]

Nice replies guys, I think there could be places for both of you on the Obama campaign staff.

Thank you. Speaking only for myself this is a high compliment.

B&H NEVER supplied their return policy or the other terms and conditions they NOW quote well after the deal was made.

It's on our site for any and all to read like every other retailer I can think of offhand (and since I buy stuff when I'm not working here I do see both sides of this particular fence). I don't know of any retailer in any industry who opens a conversation with a prospective customer with, "Glad you're here. Before anything else here's the return policy."

It's also worth noting this wasn't your first purchase here, so it could be reasonably presumed you had prior knowledge.

B&H can try to defend their actions, but I am absolutely certain that Henry Posner has not reviewed the actual history of this issue.

There must be a certain satisfaction in being so certain and so absolutely wrong all at once.

Henry claims no one else has had an issue with these housings. Has anyone else used this housing with the monitor back? Try apples to apples Henry.

As I said earlier, we've sold quite a handful since 1/1/08. I presume some of those folks have used it from then to now.

I have requested contact information for the B&H legal department four separate times, and this request continues to be completely ignored.

I will be happy to forward your entire purchase transaction history and contact info to our legal people this morning.

Henry, you should short circuit this and call me directly to genuinely attempt to resolve this issue. I notice you want everyone else to do that for you.

You may note that I emailed you AND the manufacturer yesterday before posting my earlier reply here. You can ask Sam Gates but it's possible he's here because of that e-mail. And, I'm the most readily accessible person in B&H and have been for a decade. I'm well known as the guy here who cuts red-tape for customers and generally acts as the customer ombudsman. I'd have been happy to look into this sooner, had you brought it to my attention.

 

[Equinox Housings]

Bruce,

I guess I don't understand, by the sounds of it you are anxious to do the legal thing with B&H. May I ask you, What do you want us to do? (Equinox)

You said you called and we spoke on the 25th of june, this is the 8th business day. With the holiday you should have received your PREPAID label yesterday or today.

At no point did I say any email went to spam, there was no email received from you to go into spam. We do not have an auto reply email..sorry. I look forward to posting of these auto-replies cause I have never seen one or used one.

Like I said previously I understand your frustration....you have a warranty issue once I sent the PREPAID label it is now your responsibility to box the unit up safely and simply give it to any ups driver and it comes here for evaluation and replacement.

It is unfortunate that the first time you assembled your housing was on the dive boat, we all expect things to work properly but if due diligence is done by assembling your unit prior to on the dive boat we would have been more than happy to send a replacement monitor to your home or even the Bahamas, we have done things like that before. A hole big enough to slide a nickle through seems like it would be very obvious.

Could you also provide purchase date of unit and the date you left for your trip for our records. I have no warranty card on file, you were instructed in your assembly instructions to please send that in. No worries we will still honor the warranty even though that wasn't done yet.

Here at Equinox we honor the warranty that we provide, we feel we have done our due diligence in responding to your matter in a timely fashion and telling you that if it is our fault the unit leaked we will replace all underwater equipment at no charge to you.

Please explain to me what else we can do, we provide a warranty and we honor it.

We have sent you the label and I have asked you to call me collect or by our 800 number, we have received no call.

What more can we do. I would like to resolve this issue on our end, verbal attacks and misrepresentation of us to the diving community will not speed this situation up and quite possibly slow it down. Lets take care of this the right way, we are doing business in an honorable way we ask that both parties act responsibly to achieve resolution to this unfortunate issue.

I would also like it to be known that B&H is THE leader in underwater camera and housing sales in our industry and has always acted in a responsible and positive manner. It is unfortunate that this issue happened, over the past 3 years B&H has sold hundreds of wonderful working Equinox housings and many lcd backs and there have been no problems.

I will not be involved in any more insulting exchanges, we honor our warranty and that is that. Send the unit back and we will make it right.

Please feel free to contact us by sales@equinoxhousings.com, (888)438-8943 toll free or 269.381.2101

We look forward to resolving this issue for you.

Best regards,

Sam Gates
Equinox HOusings

 

[henryp]

I would also like it to be known that B&H is THE leader in underwater camera and housing sales in our industry and has always acted in a responsible and positive manner. It is unfortunate that this issue happened, over the past 3 years B&H has sold hundreds of wonderful working Equinox housings and many lcd backs and there have been no problems.

This is very gracious and much appreciated. Thank you.

 

[Dive Right In Scuba]

Bruce brought his camera in to us to make sure he wasnt overlooking something....and it is a bad housing...Im not trying to get involved, but it seems like Equinox is doing everything they can to make the situation right. Being the Manufacturer of JUST the housing, there is no more that they can do....I even talked with Sam to tell him such, seems like a really customer service oriented company!!

On the other hand, I also called B&H and asked for Henry....as for being the easiest person to get ahold of Henry, the guy that answered hasnt even heard of you....and the next person transferred me to your voicemail and I left a message.....at 11:30am today...still no response. Which is fine, Im not your customer....just someone looking out for one of my own customers that bought from you. The package that you sold, and bundled together( camera and housing) didnt work and the camera flooded.....In my book, thats a problem you guys need to fix as it was your package, not Equinox's package. I think Bruce should be talking with you guys about resolving this. If I sell a customer a Regulator package, I put it all together, and the Manu. didnt seal the battery on the computer and it leaks...what do I do??? Tell the customer they are SOL? NO, I give them another computer.....A package he bought from B&H was defective, whether it was your fault or someone elses before it got to the customer, it doesnt matter...it wasnt/isnt his fault that it flooded and he should get a new housing and camera.....

Now if he had flooded it by not using it properly, I wouldnt be saying this. Its obvious however, that the housing caused the camera to flood. Well, Equinox doesnt cover camera floodings....but they didnt sell the camera/housing package...B&H did. A package you sold was defective before it went into a camera bucket.....Lets be honest and quick about this...Just fix it...There is no need for this to have gone on this long or to have gotten this far....Its Customer Service 101......Get the package back and send a new one...Case closed

PS Henry, I was going to wait on my post until you contacted me, but I still have yet to hear from you.....so i have nothing else to base my above post on except what I know..... Sam, It was a pleasure talking with you and keep up the great customer service!!

 

[henryp]

Im not trying to get involved...

You're not? Yet, here you are, divin' right into the fray.

On the other hand, I also called B&H and asked for Henry....as for being the easiest person to get ahold of Henry, the guy that answered hasnt even heard of you....and the next person transferred me to your voicemail and I left a message.....at 11:30am today...still no response.

I am sorry I did not reply to your voicemail in a speedier manner. You may have noticed my e-mail is in my sig -- just another option.

PS Henry, I was going to wait on my post until you contacted me, but I still have yet to hear from you.....so i have nothing else to base my above post on except what I know...

I regret the unavoidable delay and taking note of your apparent impatience I will check my messages first thing in the morning and return your call if there's anything to add to what's already in this thread.

 

[brucedd]

OK folks, I hope you are kinda getting the B&H picture here? They smile when they take your money, insult you left and right if you voice concern about a problem.

Stay away from B&H.

Henry, I asked for escalation persons at B&H and no one gave me your name or contact info. Read the threads again (lol). I constantly asked for someone to help and B&H just tries to squash the complaint and/or spouts incorrect info. I guess your contact info was to "just come to me" much like your terms and conditions of the sale. Osmosis?

You seem to be missing the issue of the MONITOR BACK, do you know what that is? It is a SEPARATE accessory purchase that is used in place of the solid plastic housing back. I find it interesting that you claim to have sold "quite a handful" of this exact configuration, when in fact your website and database had the WRONG monitor back (8" instead of 6") as the appropriate accessory for the HD 6. So one of two things is true. Either you:

1. Sold "quite a handful" of the wrong monitor backs previously, and replaced them all with the correct one which have been all happily been used by your customers

OR

2. No one else purchased the HD 6 for a Canon HV 30 with a monitor back, thus there is no true apples-to-apples comparison.

If #1 is true, B&H left their data incorrect and continued to send out the wrong monitor back inconveniencing every purchaser (the site STILL has the wrong monitor back paired with the housing, and customer service absolutely claims that the 8" is in fact the right one (I have the email from B&H stating just that, then after B&H spoke with Equinox, confirmed that the 8" monitor back was indeed incorrect, and that Equinox would drop ship me the correct 6" monitor back). Again, incorrect monitor back info REMAINS on your site and in your database.

If #2 is true, and no one actually has paired the HD 6 for the Canon HV30 with the 6" monitor back, then you just might have to concede that there COULD be a general engineering error causing flooding with this combination. I know there is a problem with mine. If that is an oddity, I guess you take a chance with every housing if they are not all engineered relatively identically? Great for everyone that got a good one, but I remain screwed.

In either case, your statements are inconsistent with logic and fact.

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

personal attack removed

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I hope not, but maybe I was wrong about one thing. Maybe you REALLY have reviewed the entire transaction and email history. If you did, everyone needs to be even more concerned as you remain fairly ignorant of the products and accessories and completely uncaring about the facts. If you read the history and understand the products you should KNOW that if B&H agreed to an RMA for the housing, then you should AT LEAST also include the monitor back, and spare monitor back battery.

You have not even begun to discuss my purchase of the extended warranty that should cover replacing / repairing the camera. It would seem to me that if you had reviewed all the facts, and cared about some reasonable outcome other than winning a verbal battle, you would have suggested a solution that included Equinox replacing the housing and the warranty replacing the camera. Maybe you missed that detail? Maybe you really just don't give a flying truck about making me reasonably whole for my $3000? In any case, it is enlightening.

Henry, who is your boss at B&H? My guess is that they would be rather interested in this thread and how “well” you handled this.

I do not want the equipment replaced so I can go diving next year with one year old technology at introductory prices. I will accept all equipment purchased in working condition now along with airfare and lodging at Small Hope Bay Lodge for 10 days for 2 people so I can film what I purchased the equipment to film. Other than that, I want a full refund, plus interest and costs incurred.

Folks, please read the B&H replies above over and over and over. This is how you can expect to be treated by B&H if you do not just send you money and walk away quietly. Please do not let this happen to you.

Sam, no reply whatsoever caused me to make my conclusion about Equinox. I will be very happy to reverse my opinion and publicly say so (equally as enthusiastically) if that conclusion was in fact premature. However, I still have received no contact from Equinox other than on this forum, and unless you have a plan for refunding my camera, you are only part of a possible solution. I do appreciate your interest in working this out somehow, however your claim of any "misrepresentation" of Equinox by me is false. I have misrepresented NOTHING, only accurately represented the facts as they occrred and are documented. Wait for the detailed post with all the emails, pictures and video of me sliding 2 Equinox stickers and a ScubaBoard Sticker between the housing and the "sealed" monitor back.

You ask for purchase info, when you drop shipped me both the spare monitor back battery/charger and the replacement (correct) 6" monitor back itself. I am happy to provide the info, but I would appreciate you also fully researching the history, especially before accusing me of making misrepresentations.

I did NOT assemble the housing for the first time on the dive boat. I assembled it in Illinois, then again in my room at Andros Island, and carried it completely assembled to the dive boat and placed it in the camera bucket. You will see (if I ever receive a shipping label and some agreement in writing regarding the nature of why I am shipping this equipment to you) that the monitor back appears sealed, however the screw of the monitor mounting bracket contacts the camera mounting tray preventing a true seal. It is not as obvious as you are trying to make it sound. And you making that statement without ever having seen the problem is absurd. Send the label. I am still waiting.

Thanks for the 800 number. I am very sorry that I did not call the very first business day of having that available to me. You see, I have to actually perform activities for compensation so I can pay for this unusable equipment. Why don't you call me. I will email my number.

The equipment was purchased June 2nd from B&H. We left for Andros June 13. It flooded first day of diving (June 14). I sent B&H an email June 15 - content pasted here:

I AM NOW IN ANDROS ISLAND, BAHAMAS AND THE UNDERWATER VIDEO HOUSING PURCHASED FROM YOU AS A PACKAGE LEAKED IN WHILE ONLY IN THE CAMERA BUCKET ON THE DIVE BOAT THE VERY FIRST DAY OF DIVING HERE. THE CAMERA IS NOW UNUSABLE AND I BOUGHT THIS PACKAGE TO USE THIS TRIP, AND IT HAS NEVER BEEN USED AS A RESULT.

THIS LEAK IS DUE TO A MANUFACTURING ERROR (THE MONITOR BACK DOES NOT SEAL WATER TIGHT TO THE HOUSING.

I EXPECT TO RETURN ALL ITEMS PURCHASED IN THIS ORDER FOR A FULL REFUND INCLUDING SHIPPING COSTS.

I WILL NOT BE AVAILABLE TO DISCUSS THIS UNTIL MY RETURN TO THE U.S. JUNE 23.

I AM VERY DISAPPOINTED THAT THIS POOR EQUIPMENT HAS CAUSED ME TO LOSE THE ABILITY TO VIDEO THIS VACATION, AND WILL ACCEPT NOTHING LESS THAN A FULL AND COMPLETE REFUND.

BRUCE DEDIVITIS
TEL # omitted (Home # after June 23rd)

I guess I am a bit confused how you would get a new housing and/or monitor back to remote Andros Island in the Bahamas in time to save some of my dive trip, when I can't seem to get a shipping label delivered to me here in the States in under 2 weeks?

Regarding the email and spam, Henry had suggested that perhaps the reason I had not heard from you was that your emails may have been blocked by my spam filter. They were not. I submitted my emails via your "contact us" on your website and did receive an email back for each email I sent. Did you look at the PDF attachment in my earlier post? It includes those emails for reference. If they are not auto emails, someone at Equinox is receiving incoming email and replying with blank emails. Odd.

What I want is my money back. All of it. For the housing, the monitor back, the camera, the pelican case, the SD card, the mini DV tapes, the head cleaner, the spare camera battery, the battery charger, the spare monitor back battery and charger, shipping, warranty, UK light and housing adapter, and anything else I ordered that I may have missed.

Do that, and this ends. Don't do that, and we move to attorneys, actual costs plus expenses and damages. Not good for anyone usually except the attorneys.

B&H wants me to RMA the housing back to them. Equinox would like me to send it to them so they can evaluate it. Assuming we get to a point of trust that I am ready to let it out of my possession and have measured and filmed every part of the equipment, who do I send it to?

You know, people who lose their homes in a disaster will be most upset about losing their pictures and home videos because unlike most other possessions those things can not be replaced. B&H and Equinox specialize in the photography sector and I would think should be more sensitive to just what this has cost me. It is not just the $3000. It is my memories of my son’s graduation dive trip with his dad that are now NOT on video. You both took that from me. Maybe not intentionally, but you did cost me that nonetheless. You owe me.

Do the right thing. Let's get to a fair solution.

Bruce