Exploding scuba tank kills one - Florida

[gypsyjim]

Gypsyjim's posit was the victim in the door moving outside, tank not in apartment....open door allows pressure to equalize quickly, less likelihood of overpressure...

That scenario was mentioned early on. Like others here, I am privy to no really reliable info, and simply speculating with the bits and pieces we have heard from media news stories. NEVER a terribly reliable news source in my experience.

 

[Rick Murchison]

... Regarding the presssure change I believe I accidentally called it absolute degrees, when it should be Kelvin. 70 f is 294 Kelvin, 95 f is 308 Kelvin. That should take a 3600 psi tank or 36% over fill to 3789 or 43% overfill. Can a genius please double check my math?

ok... 3600psi is a 50% overfill on a LP steel tank (2640 is already a 10% overfill... the tank has a service pressure of 2400 psi). Raising the temp from 70 to 95 F would bring it up to 3770, a 57% overfill.
I'm not going to get in any great big arguments w/r/t overfilling LP steels, but I will say that I get *real uncomfortable* at anything above 3300 psi. (37.5% overfill).
Rick

 

[inventor]

"The explosion here in Fayetteville"[/I]...?

The O2 tank explosion...

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/accidents-incidents/365310-o2-tank-explosion.html

 

[Rick Murchison]

...aluminum tank...

FWIW, Aluminum doesn't have the elasticity of steel. There are steel tanks still in service that are well over a hundred years old (not scuba, obviously. for Scuba we'd have to say "well over 50") and still testing just fine. My feeling is that AL tanks in regular use will probably start showing signs of fatigue long before steel, and while overfilling a brand new AL tank may be low risk, I sure wouldn't overfill any AL tank that had been around awhile. As a practical matter I start getting nervous around AL tanks at about 3300 psi... same as LP steel (makes it easy to remember one number, eh? )
Rick

 

[Some X Dry]

That defies the logic of accident analysis and Pareto analysis.

If we want to talk about what kills most cave divers then over filling tanks is way, way down a list that probably starts with driving cars.

I respect the dead but be logical about this. You do NOT know that overfilling was even at issue here, and if the tank was aluminum then even if it was overfilled you can cool your horses because the overfilling of aluminum cylinders is not condoned by any dive shop that I know of.


Regarding the presssure change I believe I accidentally called it absolute degrees, when it should be Kelvin. 70 f is 294 Kelvin, 95 f is 308 Kelvin. That should take a 3600 psi tank or 36% over fill to 3789 or 43% overfill. Can a genius please double check my math?

It's good for all who think it is ok to overfill that there will probably not be anyway of telling if this was the cause. In fact it's my belief that even if it were there are some who would continue it's practice. Merely side stepping my point by pointing out the risk to Cave divers being low on the risk list is comic at best. You want more gas get a bigger tank or higher PSI tank. Configure your gear to work with it. Use all those math skills to figure out how to stay safe instead of how to be-unsafe.

 

[Rick Murchison]

Whatever exploded, it threw the diver thru the front door, threw the back door screen across the lot, broke the windows in the apartment, broke car windows in the lot, and more.

I distinctly remember an incident back in the 60's where a steel 72 went off under a car (it had been put under the car to keep it out of the sun, but the sun moved... imagine that!). The explosion overturned the car and moved it about ten feet to the side. So pushing a person around is small potatoes to what a tank explosion *can* do.
Rick

 

[Jax]

Violent scuba tank blast kills Iraqi war veteran at St. Petersburg condo - St. Petersburg Times

has a clear statement on the location of the victim:

T. PETERSBURG ­— Greg Sullivan saw the explosion before he heard it.

The 58-year-old retired welder was sitting down to his morning tea and cookie when he saw the condominium behind his unit shake like a bomb had detonated. The walls bulged, then came a single, concussive blast.

Sullivan called 911 and ran to his neighbor's unit and kicked in the back door, already cracked from the explosion. Through the haze and dust he saw a man lying across the threshold of the front door, his head in the lap of a woman, bright red blood pooling.

Also, on the damage:

Vanhorn had been carrying the scuba tank into the parking lot of the condo complex at 5865 37th Ave. N, said St. Petersburg Fire and Rescue Lt. Joel Granata. The tank burst, blowing out the condo's door and windows and damaging vehicles within a 100-foot debris field.

Sounds like he was just at the door . . .

 

[AfterDark]

View attachment j_botle_bang.pdf

Busrt disks should be changed at every hydro at least that's what I do.


This is a AL tank. The other is pic is what's left of a truck after a tank unknown type blew up.

 

[scubafanatic]

FWIW, Aluminum doesn't have the elasticity of steel. There are steel tanks still in service that are well over a hundred years old (not scuba, obviously. for Scuba we'd have to say "well over 50") and still testing just fine. My feeling is that AL tanks in regular use will probably start showing signs of fatigue long before steel, and while overfilling a brand new AL tank may be low risk, I sure wouldn't overfill any AL tank that had been around awhile. As a practical matter I start getting nervous around AL tanks at about 3300 psi... same as LP steel (makes it easy to remember one number, eh? )
Rick

AL 100's are full @ 3300 PSI.....it's NOT an overfill.

 

[craracer]

I'm going to have to call nonsense on this one, unless he had a large cylinder for filling. Far too much damage to be caused by the typical sized dive cylinder. Here's a link to some video of the residence post-"explosion"

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