FIRST TECH Course

[steinbil]

I wanted to follow up.
Based on information mostly gained here I contacted RAID and provided all the information. As well as my text conversations with the instructor and the dive shop owner. This was Steve, Lewis and PJ all high level management or VPs there. I had high hopes based on conversations that they would see the people that represent them locally here had not acted in a professional manner, provided a complete training or delivered any level of customer service. I've spent hours and hours on this.

What I got, several months later, only when I asked, from PJ(Marketing)was:

We have been in contact with the instructor and action has been taken.

I wrote back that I found this inadequate for incomplete training, disgusting treatment from a customer service viewpoint and being treated as a stupid, inferior, and ininformed diver by the instructor and his manager. I also said in the interest of transparency I felt they should let me know what the action taken was.

This time i was answered by Steve(VP):

He said since I checked off the training a few months earlier there was nothing they could do. That action was taken, but they couldn't share it due to privacy concerns. Further that they considered the matter closed.

I wrote back saying that I'm getting 2 responses, neither of which was adequate. That I have worked in Customer service most of my life and would never let a customer leave with this type of experience. That the response was way to abrupt and did not really provide any answers. As far as the time frame-you don't know what you don't know when you first complete a training. It was only after doing tech dives some time later and trying to arrange more dives with my instructor had he become more nasty and telling me I was cheap, asking to do things that were unsafe( doing more time after clearing deco under the boat-it isn't unsafe) and that I wasn't thinking correctly-I realized how bad my training had been and things that had been missed.

I've had no other response. My issue was not with RAID but with the instructor and the shop manager. After these responses, RAID has failed me as well.

Now, after days of my time, I'm over all of this.
I have moved on and I'm training on Doubles. I'm doing TDI Decompression Procedures with a fantastic instructor. I find the TDI materials are much more thorough and in depth. He's Gabriel Rioux at Atmosphere resort in Dauin, PH. He is patient, answers all my questions and is working to make up the things that were left out in my RAID course. Atmospheres shop is fantastic and the gear is new and top level. Thank God after all that mess I found a competent and understanding professional.

Happy diving everyone!

and thank you to everyone who tried to help and gave helpful information and advice.

Wow! That sounds horrible. Based on the info in this thread it makes RAID look very bad. Especially since you were in contact with high level management. Surprised they didn't offer you any compensation - that's just customer service 101. These are the things that really matter, in my opinion, how the agency handles quality control. This is obviously just one data point, but if it is accurate it's a big deal. I guess they're not going to come on the forums to defend this, but man...

I'm glad after all that you found a good instructor and that you're happy with your current situation. Happy diving to you!

 

[rexman24]

I love RAID's system for things like this, but it sounds like you may have just mass clicked through the skills.. The standards for every dive are listed and must be checked off by the student AND the instructor. If you haven't already signed off on them, than I would hold off, and relay that to RAID QA. If you just clicked through and signed off as having done them... well... I would read things before just signing off. I tell my students please triple check you understand as you sign off and if you don't remember/ don't think we did something in the list, text me. The right bubble in this picture is for instructor sign off, left is student sign off. View attachment 799758View attachment 799757

Thanks
I did admit to checking off 2 skills that weren't done, that was my error. The other three things that weren't done there was no check off.
Why?
You'd have to know the instructor. There is an assumption of superiority, an inability of a lowly trainee to question the master, it's not an environment that fosters anything but going with the flow. My objective was to complete the course at the time. I was told by him to complete the check off to get to the end, so I did. Only after, once I did Tech dives and trying to schedule more dives with him did it become clear how much had been omitted. When your freshly trained, you don't know what you don't know. Look back on your OW training-think of what you know after tens or hundreds of dives compared to what you knew after your first course.

 

[rexman24]

Wow! That sounds horrible. Based on the info in this thread it makes RAID look very bad. Especially since you were in contact with high level management. Surprised they didn't offer you any compensation - that's just customer service 101. These are the things that really matter, in my opinion, how the agency handles quality control. This is obviously just one data point, but if it is accurate it's a big deal. I guess they're not going to come on the forums to defend this, but man...

I'm glad after all that you found a good instructor and that you're happy with your current situation. Happy diving to you!

Yes I'm really shaking my head about this as I gave them all the info and opportunity to do the right thing on a silver platter but........

 

[berndo]

He said since I checked off the training a few months earlier there was nothing they could do. That action was taken, but they couldn't share it due to privacy concerns. Further that they considered the matter closed.

I wrote back saying that I'm getting 2 responses, neither of which was adequate. That I have worked in Customer service most of my life and would never let a customer leave with this type of experience. That the response was way to abrupt and did not really provide any answers.

I all for bitching about sh!tty service and training agencies with sloppy or no QC but what should the RAID people have done here? You checked the boxes than complained about it later. The only thing they can do at this point is to ask the instructor for his side of the story... month later. What should they have done in your opinion?

Also I rarely see pool like conditions in the ocean. Shallow water usually involves some combination of waves, viz limits, currents, watercraft, and as I said before in the time it takes to do a dive conditions can be vasy different than when you started.

You're not correct about this. I've done lots of CW sessions in the ocean with pool-like conditions. I can think of plenty shallow pool-like places all over the world with super stable conditions.

 

[BlueTrin]

Thanks
I did admit to checking off 2 skills that weren't done, that was my error. The other three things that weren't done there was no check off.
Why?
You'd have to know the instructor. There is an assumption of superiority, an inability of a lowly trainee to question the master, it's not an environment that fosters anything but going with the flow. My objective was to complete the course at the time. I was told by him to complete the check off to get to the end, so I did. Only after, once I did Tech dives and trying to schedule more dives with him did it become clear how much had been omitted. When your freshly trained, you don't know what you don't know. Look back on your OW training-think of what you know after tens or hundreds of dives compared to what you knew after your first course.

If you tick them off, they cannot claim you didn’t do them.

It will be your side vs his side: he can just say you did them and now because you are riled up you are lying or exaggerating? (Not saying you lied)

 

[steinbil]

The only thing they can do at this point is to ask the instructor for his side of the story... month later. What should they have done in your opinion?

How about offering to retake the class with a different instructor without paying, refunding the cost of the class, other training/instruction?

Even if he's not telling the full story, it would just be smart to offer something to a client that had a bad experience, regardless of who is at fault.

Yes, for disciplinary action against an instructor they should have very good evidence, but when somebody had a bad experience taking a class and is complaining that standards were not followed, offer something.

 

[rexman24]

If you tick them off, they cannot claim you didn’t do them.

It will be your side vs his side: he can just say you did them and now because you are riled up you are lying or exaggerating? (Not saying you lied)

2 of 5 things missed had check offs. I owned those 2.

 

[rexman24]

I wanted to post a text exchange between myself and the instructor to kind of demonstrate the general atmosphere of our interactions but I'm not sure I have it still.

 

[BlueTrin]

2 of 5 things missed had check offs. I owned those 2.

Yea hopefully they did something about the 3 other ones.

 

[RainPilot]

Im sorry to hear about your experience. I will be following up on my end as best I can. I am glad you found someone who is more suited to your needs, wishing you all the best and safe diving moving forward.