Freediving DCS?

[gangrel441]

http://www.gerd.com/

GERD - Gastroesophageal Reflux Disease

Gastrointestinal system creates chemical reactions that convert liquids to gasses. Liquids don't compress or expand with pressure, gasses do. One potential example of how an overexpansion injury could occur without breathing compressed air - hypothetically.

I don't think it could happen, but as I said above...I never say never....

 

[TeddyDiver]

Do you have a link?...Unless the lungs are "overexpanded" at the surface, they can not over expand UW while freediving. Id like to hear more about these injuries.

They dont overexpand. Fluids from stomac get in ones lungs and weaken lung tissues. excess coughing, also triggered by these acids, creates overpressure hits due uw environment and the allready damaged tissue gets damaged.
I'm not a doc so can't explain it better, and sorry, don't have a link only the magazine..

Gangrell441: According DAN it's happened.

 

[pipedope]

I can say with 100% certanty that unless he had an UW source of air then an overexpansion injury would be impossable. You just dont come up with more air then you went down with. Given his dive profile, Im still fairy certan that it was not DCS. The question is, what was it then? For that answer, more info would be needed.

Is it safe to say you have never had a reverse block?

Equalizing the air in your ears and sinuses gives a number of places where you can get a block on the way up and get an overpressure injury, it is not exclusive to the lungs.

Not much chance (very close to zero) of a LUNG overexpansion injury on breath hold but there is always some risk if you get pressurized and the depressurized.

In any case of a diving injury or suspected diving injury I suggest calling DAN. They may consider many factors like, did you scuba earlier that day or the day before? You really want diving doctors when dealing with suspected diving injuries.

 

[Wildcard]

But we are talking about lung injuries not barotrauma in general.

Gastric acids in the airway can only occur from aspiration. Acid burns in the lungs could cause injuries like that but that wasnt addressed here. With the given profile for five to ten dives at mid depths, I seriously doubt any symptoms had anything to do with his diving.

 

[bolts]

hey bolts, were you "packing" on these dives?

Nope, no packing on any depth dives.

 

[gangrel441]

...I seriously doubt any symptoms had anything to do with his diving.

And here I agree with you. I am simply acknowledging that "I seriously doubt" and "I am 100% certain it is impossible" are two very, very different statements.

 

[DocVikingo]

Hi Wildcard,

You state: "I would say the ear numbness may be an unusual symptom of an ear barotrauma, or it could be inner ear DCS."

Actually, it really couldn't be inner ear DCS. Inner ear DCS presents with vertigo, nausea, vomitting, hearing loss, nystagmus (rapid involuntary rhythmic eye movements) and/or tinnitus (ringing, beating or roaring sounds with no external source). There is no mechanism whereby inner ear DCS or barotrauma could result in ear numbness only and you will not find it mentioned as a symptom of either of these conditions in any professional literature.

Regards,

DocVikingo

 

[DocVikingo]

It appears that it was gangrel441 who made that statement.

Regards,

DocVikingo

 

[bolts]

Just an update, I called in sick today as I'm just feeling really crappy and fatigued. However, my joints for the most part, feel fine, and there isn't much numbness as earlier in the week.

I just got off the phone with the hyperbaric doc I saw earlier in the week (who's really great, btw!), and after calling around to DAN, amongst other places, he thinks that the fatigue I'm feeling right now is a result of the chest 'trauma' that I experienced in the dive. He said that where the blood came from will likely remain a mystery, but the fatigue symptoms I'm describing now are likely due to that healing itself, similar to a pneumonia-like injury.

However, I mentioned the relief in my joints after the hyperbaric treatment on Wed., and he said that it's inconclusive whether or not the treatment caused the joints to feel better or if they would have been better by themselves without the treatment. In other words, it's still not clear whether I did or did not have DCS. He said it's unlikely, but not totally impossible, given that we don't know if I'm more susceptible to DCS due to an unknown condition that further testing may reveal.

Anyways, thanks to everyone who chimed in on this thread offering advice. :14:

 

[gangrel441]

Hi Wildcard,

You state: "I would say the ear numbness may be an unusual symptom of an ear barotrauma, or it could be inner ear DCS."

Actually, it really couldn't be inner ear DCS. Inner ear DCS presents with vertigo, nausea, vomitting, hearing loss, nystagmus (rapid involuntary rhythmic eye movements) and/or tinnitus (ringing, beating or roaring sounds with no external source). There is no mechanism whereby inner ear DCS or barotrauma could result in ear numbness only and you will not find it mentioned as a symptom of either of these conditions in any professional literature.

Regards,

DocVikingo

Thanks Doc....still learning here...