Actually it has been three decades since I dairy farmed but thinking back... yes, I've seen a cow do the frog kick. 
Frog Kick: The Cleaner Way To Get Ahead
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I found that it's better to practice not on the floor but laying on the table down to hips. Legs should be out in the air. It's more difficult but in this way you can controll whether you are using your legs down to knees or not (which you should not) and at the same time you practice the perfect trim (knees at the same lebel as hips).... And don't forget to wear you fins.Uncle Pug:
After doing this several time all muscles were hurting - so finally in the water it was much easier...
Mania
Mania.. you are right.. it is more difficult that way.. and not as effective because you are putting an unnatural strain on your lower back.
The idea is to develop muscle memory and in the water you are completely supported and your back muscles do not have to hold your legs *up*.
As for using your upper legs... yes you do use them: out to load for the kick while holding the fins horizontal and then in with the ankles cocked for the power stroke.
The idea is to develop muscle memory and in the water you are completely supported and your back muscles do not have to hold your legs *up*.
As for using your upper legs... yes you do use them: out to load for the kick while holding the fins horizontal and then in with the ankles cocked for the power stroke.
CHSpaintballer2
Registered
Normally if I'm swimming in shallow water I try not to use the flutter kick because I'm the kind of person that likes to dive down and find some shells or fish on the bottom, and just take a look around before coming up for more air. I've never used the frog kick, I'll have to try it this weekend when my Dad & I go fishing (probably going on the Rainbow; I'm taking my snorkeling stuff so I can drift behind him a little ways and take a look around), plus I get to try the mask that has prescription lenses I got for Christmas in 2003 and haven't had a chance to use it in any body of water besides pools and bathtubs. Not yet, anyways. Hopefully I'll get to use it tomorrow or Sunday morning\afternoon.
Hopefully I'll get to use it tomorrow or Sunday morning\afternoon.
CHS, with the frog kick it action is kick ~n~ glide... don't forget the ~n~glide part... that is where the air savings comes into play and that will be a key ingredient for you.
Hmmm, the way I've been taught was that my hips and a bit of thigh was on the table. But the rest was free in the air.Uncle Pug:
That's absolutly true but the major power goes from ankles. And my mistakes before I was shown how to do it was that the major power came from my hips. This resulted in having finally my knees below my torso so I looked like thisUncle Pug:
----\/- (the \/ are my knees). After some exercises on the table I've learn to keep my knees in the same line as my torso. But it was a pain in the back
Anyway - as for me it worked better than the floor. And my back muscles needed some exercise.
Mania
PS. The thing I still can't figure out - although both on the floor and on the table is OK while uw is horrible - back frog kick. I don't think I'll ever learn this one.
If the motive power is coming from your ankles then you are sculling not frog kicking.
Backwards frogkick:
You need to extend your legs and fins straight back to load for the power stroke.
Often when folks do this they end up pushing themselves forward and so their *backward* frogkick ends up being a back~n~forth frogkick with little net movement.
Another thing that happens is that they end up doing the butt up ascent. Remember how you feel doing this as the up-frog can actually be used later... but for now it is something to get beyond.
Here is where the problem lies: look at this picture I posted earlier in this thread and then look at Netdoc's profile picture (sorry Pete, it was a good illustration.) Notice which way the fin tips are pointing? Which way are your fin tips pointing when you are diving, especially when you are trying to do the reverse frogkick?
If they are pointing up at all when you push them back to load for the reverse kick your fins will push against the water and propel you forward! What you need to do is tighten the muscles on the front of your lower leg and pull your toes (and fin tips) down before trying to push them back.
This will seem exagerated at first but you should feel like you are *dropping* your fins down... not your knees... just your fins. Once you can do this without moving forward you are ready to move to the next step of the reverse kick.
With your fins back cock your ankles as they would be at the end of a normal frog kick. Now sweep your legs out to the side where they would be at the beginning of a frog kick and uncock your ankles... hold this position momentarily and glide... backward.
IF you find that your reverse kick is propelling you not only backward but upward it is because you have your fin tips pointing up. Keep the bottom of your fin horizontal and you won't go up.
I said that later... after you've mastered what a real reverse kick is like... you might want to use what I call the up-frog. I use it to start an upward movement rather than just sucking in more air or hitting the inflator.
OK... back on the floor... or table, if you are in Poland.
You need to extend your legs and fins straight back to load for the power stroke.
Often when folks do this they end up pushing themselves forward and so their *backward* frogkick ends up being a back~n~forth frogkick with little net movement.
Another thing that happens is that they end up doing the butt up ascent. Remember how you feel doing this as the up-frog can actually be used later... but for now it is something to get beyond.
Here is where the problem lies: look at this picture I posted earlier in this thread and then look at Netdoc's profile picture (sorry Pete, it was a good illustration.) Notice which way the fin tips are pointing? Which way are your fin tips pointing when you are diving, especially when you are trying to do the reverse frogkick?
If they are pointing up at all when you push them back to load for the reverse kick your fins will push against the water and propel you forward! What you need to do is tighten the muscles on the front of your lower leg and pull your toes (and fin tips) down before trying to push them back.
This will seem exagerated at first but you should feel like you are *dropping* your fins down... not your knees... just your fins. Once you can do this without moving forward you are ready to move to the next step of the reverse kick.
With your fins back cock your ankles as they would be at the end of a normal frog kick. Now sweep your legs out to the side where they would be at the beginning of a frog kick and uncock your ankles... hold this position momentarily and glide... backward.
IF you find that your reverse kick is propelling you not only backward but upward it is because you have your fin tips pointing up. Keep the bottom of your fin horizontal and you won't go up.
I said that later... after you've mastered what a real reverse kick is like... you might want to use what I call the up-frog. I use it to start an upward movement rather than just sucking in more air or hitting the inflator.
OK... back on the floor... or table, if you are in Poland.
UP,
That sounds like a playing a game of Twister while someone calls out the moves for square dancing!
Now... I'm off to the floor again!
Christian
That sounds like a playing a game of Twister while someone calls out the moves for square dancing!
Now... I'm off to the floor again!
Christian
Guess I'll have to get on the floor and table tonight. I was taught the rudiments of frog kicking in AOW sessions. At first it was pretty awkward. But, like others, I stuck with it, having read so much about it and hearing some pretty high quality divers espouse it. Soon it got more comfortable and I got to the point of it being my preference, it even started to feel 'natural'.
But, I always feel that my knees are dropping below horizontal. Don't have any videos or photos of myself 'frogging' (this is probably a good thing - picture Elaine dancing on Seinfeld), so just going by my feel of it. I will try the exercises and see if that helps.
But, I always feel that my knees are dropping below horizontal. Don't have any videos or photos of myself 'frogging' (this is probably a good thing - picture Elaine dancing on Seinfeld), so just going by my feel of it. I will try the exercises and see if that helps.
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