GUE vs. TDI in terms of opportunities in scientific research projects?

[Degenerate]

The courses are actually much more with expenses... they're being dishonest to score a point. The people I know ended up paying closer to 3 grand plus travel. Same range with tec1.

What extra expenses?
Gas?
Travel?
Housing?

Yes, I am certain every other agency will happily calculate these for you and include it in the adjusted listed price.

 

[rjack321]

I've never heard of a "TDI project" or a project that a TDI cert specifically gives access to.

 

[Seaweed Doc]

@Penn

If you are in Western Washington, we have a pretty healthy GUE community in the Seattle area (and the Kitsap Peninsula) that gets involved in projects, both locally and around the world. For example, we have been working with a local side-scan sonar survey company to get an accurate picture of targets on the bottom of Lake Union and Lake Washington, including diving on them to verify the target and try to get any identifying details. These projects are open to of our local members with as little as a GUE Fundamentals recreational pass (depending on the target, of course.) One of our local instructors has also been involved in some pretty high-profile exploration projects in Europe and the South Pacific recently. Those are more "exploration" projects, especially focused on photogrammetry, but we are trying to get more involved with "scientific" projects as well -- it's one of our current board's goals (myself included.)

We have weekly Wednesday Night dives (currently meeting at Cove 2 on Alki at 6pm) if you want to join us and chat about what we are working on. DM me if you want more details.

A question of personal interest from a local: When folks dive with a sidescan sonar company, are they following OSHA rules?

I work in academic diving, where it's AAUS. I've heard OSHA rules are a pain to work with.

 

[Seaweed Doc]

Speaking strictly from the scientific diving perspective in the USA , AAUS Is the key. It doesn't matter where you got the tech certs, as long as you have them.

I focus on undergraduate education and my divers on research projects are these undergrads. Since getting an undergrad who is tech trained is nearly impossible, the cost of tech diving is high, and the AAUS requirements to keep a tech certification (they effectively expire in AAUS) are substantial (i.e., you need to be doing tech diving very, very regularly, and to the depth of your AAUS certification) I've not done it.

Colleagues of mine at other institutions that had done tech diving on research projects gave up because meeting AAUS standards was too onerous and expensive. The work still happens, but it's daunting for folks who aren't going doing tech dives all the time for fun outside the scope of the project.....

 

[rjack321]

A question of personal interest from a local: When folks dive with a sidescan sonar company, are they following OSHA rules?

I work in academic diving, where it's AAUS. I've heard OSHA rules are a pain to work with.

Those aren't paid "for hire" dives so WA Labor and Industry (L&I) requirements don't apply. Which is good because they are onerous - including having a chamber on-site for decompression. (WA is an authorized state we have L&I here not federal OSHA)

 

[Nick_Radov]

A question of personal interest from a local: When folks dive with a sidescan sonar company, are they following OSHA rules?

Usually wreck explorers don't dive with a sidescan sonar "company". In the cases I know about the individuals or project organizations involved just rented a fish and towed it behind a boat for a few days. There were no paid employees so OSHA rules didn't apply.

And to avoid interrupting sonar search patterns they typically weren't even doing immediate drops. Instead they would analyze the data on shore to identify the most likely targets, then return later with fully prepared dive teams.

 

[OrcasC205]

A question of personal interest from a local: When folks dive with a sidescan sonar company, are they following OSHA rules?

I work in academic diving, where it's AAUS. I've heard OSHA rules are a pain to work with.

As @Nick_Radov suggested, we aren't actually doing the dives with the sonar company -- just using their data to identify potential targets and providing feedback to them on what we find. And as was also mentioned by @rjack321, there is no "for hire" relationship, so no L&I or OSHA requirements.

 

[PfcAJ]

Come to think of it. @SpeedyJ he's getting goofed on by his gue buddies for having taken an inferior class...

Well was it inferior?

Life’s all about choices.

 

[berndo]

Life’s all about choices.

When a few middle aged quarry commandos feel the need to goof on a 25 year old kid who's exited about cave diving, it's a choice too.

 

[amado_sarhan]

The guy/gal was asking if he/she should go with TDI or GUE if focusing on science and exploration projects, not knowing that he would unknowingly ignite the flames of diver agency wars

I've been diving for a few years, trained and certified with several agencies/instructors - including GUE and TDI. While I have to be frank that I did receive the best possible training (in my opinion) with GUE, I have seen divers who I think are better divers than I am from other agencies. When I go rec diving, it doesn't bother me (as it used to years ago) buddying up with an octo or a snorkel using diver or whatever number of dives. As long as we do proper pre-dive checks and have a good briefing, they enjoy, I enjoy, we all enjoy.

GUE training is expensive, and you can actually fail if you run out of time. You can choose not to do GUE, if you don't have the budget. But look for a good instructor who WILL fail you if you don't perform, regardless of agency. If you're looking into exploration, science projects, preservation, etc. you have to absolutely nail and be comfortable with your trim, buoyancy, and propulsion - that's if you don't want to harm yourself or the very environment you wish to study and explore. Perhaps that you already obviously knew, considering you're posting in the Technical Diving forum. Find an instructor, not an agency.

If it's about projects, honestly TDI has some catching up to do, in my opinion. GUE projects, in my opinion, are very good. I look forward to diving in China's local caves following a few fruitful GUE missions that were carried out there. (Once I have saved enough for the trip...)