Is this the average diver?

Is this the average diver?

  • Yes

    Votes: 8 5.3%
  • No

    Votes: 143 94.7%

  • Total voters
    151

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Only one instructor of the 15 or so I assisted mentioned to the OW class about SB. Yet knowing the shop & staff back then, for some reason I don't think that was on purpose. I get the feeling instructors/DMs there either weren't SB members or simply didn't think of it. There was no reason to be fearful of SB since until recently the shop was the only one for a long long way. Back then I think you needed some proof of cert. to get into the Going Pro & I to I forums and the owner was more than happy to provide that.
I found out about SB in 2007 from my first and only regular dive buddy. He was a fellow newbie and don't think he dived (much) past 2010.
I agree with your assessment that the vast majority of instructors do not know SB exists. Many who do will not mention it to their students or will tell them not to go there. I was one of those who did not mention it to my students, even when I was on the staff. I knew that when they went to SB, they would see a host of posts telling them what a POS instructor I was, and how I was only there to steal their money because I did not work for free, as all the instructors in all the other agencies apparently do.
 
ScubaBoard reflects a philosophy of diving that is a very tech heavy tribe, very heavily weighted to certain instructional standards. For a new diver this isn’t always healthy because the will have completed their classes , bought their own gear and find SB only to get ripped a new one about how they wasted their money on a death trap and the LDS ripped them off, their instructor was a conartist and they will have to start spending real money if they want to do it properly.

No new diver wants to hear that the $500 they just spent on an intro BCD was wasted and for $600 they could have better, safer and lasts forever. Also, god help the poor schlub that posts a video and asks for feedback. I’ve been diving long enough to simply ignore a lot of it, but new divers probably won’t stick around. That is not to say that I don’t get a lot from reading different threads and some of the more rigorous arguments about gear and training, but I can tell the difference between smoke and substance.

Most dive gear is safe, especially when used properly and within recreational limits. The best way for a diver to learn is from someone with more experience making similar types of dives with similar equipment. A Florida beach diver is not going to have a good experience with a Bp/w and a steel 80 if everyone he knows uses a weight integrated jacket and an AL80.
 
For much of my professional career, I kept a sign posted on the wall of my office - as a reminder for me and as food for thought for others - that was titled, 'Signs of Stagnation'. It consisted of seven bullet points:

  • 'We've never done it that way.'
  • 'We're not ready for that.'
  • 'We're doing all right without it.'
  • 'We've tried that once before.'
  • 'It costs too much.'
  • 'That's not our responsibility.'
  • 'It just won't work . . .'

In retirement (from my professional work, not from scuba instruction), I keep it on the wall in my 'scuba den' at home.

I do believe that we are all at times subject to succumbing to one or more of these mindsets. Our task is to recognize the insidious development of such attitudes, and break free of them. Frankly, too many dive shops, and too many dive professionals, fall prey to one or more of these attitudes. And, that development has caused a conspicuous shift in the diving industry: as one example the closure of (too) many dive shops which 'were not ready for that', or which were 'doing all right without it'.

I have no trouble directing students to SB. I do not worry that they will read something that might cause them to question what I have said, or taught, or done. In fact, I want them to come back and ask me about what they have read. If I am afraid that they might learn something that I DIDN'T teach them, or that is different from what I DID teach them, I am going to be unhappy much of the time.

Scuba instruction is not stagnant - it continues to evolve. Perhaps, the rate of evolution is too slow for some (or too fast for others), but the evolution will continue. In fact, several posters in this thread have been particularly instrumental in positively advancing that evolution - boulderjohn, for example, in his persevering, and ultimately successful, efforts to encourage one particular training agency to revise its approach to teaching, and embrace a 'neutral buoyancy' environment. He, and some other instructors, had to forge ahead of the 'average' instructor, in order to promote improvement, and those improvements now work to the benefit of many divers, who will become the new 'average' diver. Just because that is not the case today does not mean they won't be in the future.

Scuba equipment design and configuration is also not stagnant, and it too continues to evolve. Maybe, SB is to some extent a 'very tech heavy tribe'. Maybe, some technical divers have had to forge ahead of the 'average' equipment configuration, to find more efficient, more functional, better, safer gear configurations, so that the 'average' diver can now consider those configurations because they are now commercially available. I have already said that gear doesn't make me a diver - my skills and my attitude do that, and I make my gear work for me, not the other way around. But, that doesn't mean that I don't benefit from a gear configuration that makes it easier to achieve good buoyancy and trim, that makes it easier to move more efficiently through the water because it is far more streamlined, etc. I have specific mechanical reasons, for example, for using a metal backplate (and a wing), and I articulate those reasons to divers when I recommend they try a BP/W configuration. I don't care if it is not (yet) commonly used by the 'average' diver, or that it may not have been what they trained in. I have very specific reasons, for example, for preferring to use steel cylinders, and I articulate those reasons to divers when I recommend that they consider using a steel cylinder. And, I don't care if steel cylinders are not (yet) commonly used by the 'average' diver, or that it may not have been the cylinder that they trained in, or that many shops have available for rental. I also clearly point out that I am sharing my personal preferences, and what works for me may not be what works for everyone else. But, I also point out that those preferences are based on extensive research and analysis, and trial and error, and diving experience. And, if someone else chooses NOT to use what I use, that is absolutely fine.

If I had adopted the attitude of 'I've never done it that way before', or 'I'm doing all right without it', or 'Its costs too much', or stayed away from SB because I was told that it would cause me to question - even challenge - what I had been taught, I would have never had a chance to advance to the point I have reached, or continue to develop into the diver that I someday want to be. I really don't care what is today's 'average'. I do care about what I am today, and what I want to be tomorrow, and what I want to inspire my students - and fellow divers - to become in the future.
 
A Florida beach diver is not going to have a good experience with a Bp/w and a steel 80 if everyone he knows uses a weight integrated jacket and an AL80.

That's because that diver would be better off with a HP100, no weights needed.
 
Outside of scuba board, 95% of the divers you run into would probably be more likely to associate the term Hogarthian with Harry Potter than DIR.

SB readers are atypical.
 
ScubaBoard reflects a philosophy of diving that is a very tech heavy tribe, very heavily weighted to certain instructional standards. For a new diver this isn’t always healthy because the will have completed their classes , bought their own gear and find SB only to get ripped a new one about how they wasted their money on a death trap and the LDS ripped them off, their instructor was a conartist and they will have to start spending real money if they want to do it properly.

No new diver wants to hear that the $500 they just spent on an intro BCD was wasted and for $600 they could have better, safer and lasts forever. Also, god help the poor schlub that posts a video and asks for feedback. I’ve been diving long enough to simply ignore a lot of it, but new divers probably won’t stick around. That is not to say that I don’t get a lot from reading different threads and some of the more rigorous arguments about gear and training, but I can tell the difference between smoke and substance.

Most dive gear is safe, especially when used properly and within recreational limits. The best way for a diver to learn is from someone with more experience making similar types of dives with similar equipment. A Florida beach diver is not going to have a good experience with a Bp/w and a steel 80 if everyone he knows uses a weight integrated jacket and an AL80.
Yeah I agree with everything here. "Ripping a new one" and "instructor was a con artist" may be a bit rough, but true on some posts.
To add a point, there are also those of us who buy the newbie ("not as good or safe") equipment (even used) and never really graduate to anything "better". Yours truly of course.
 
Okay, I see how you could imply that, but I didn't say it.
It's amazing how personal opinions can be so misconstrued. I didn't read that declaration in your post either. People who want to be offended will go out of their way to be offended. I've been accused for very same thing only because I had an opinion different then they did. It's like if you don't fully agree with them, then you're bashing them. If you don't say that they are the best thing since sliced bread, then you're bashing them. Meh. We all have our likes and dislikes. We all have our preferences too. If we all dove and trained the same way, SB would be boring as hell.

There are a few who are hypersensitive to what they refer to as 'agency bashing'. I wish they were just as sensitive to forum bashing. I hear criticism all the time about ScubaBoard: "you just let anyone post what they believe". Yes, we do. In fact, one owner of a particular agency has told me that he believes that I'm the most irresponsible person in the industry for letting all you hooligans post what you think without vetting each and every one. It's tiresome. I often point out that we have more safeguards against abuse than Facebook... oh, but it's somehow different with FB. No, I really don't get it. I don't understand the paranoia that some exhibit towards ScubaBoard. They've gotten students here, they've met friends through here, they've learned about new gear here, they've might have even met some of their instructors here: but they certainly won't recommend us to anyone. Mostly because people might express opinions different than their own and that's bashing.

A couple of years ago, I was at a dive shop in my area, driving the ScubaBoard van. A guy was pretty impressed with how I have the van set up for diving. Hey, I'm also impressed with what I've done with it. :D Anyway, he goes on to tell me how bad ScubaBoard is. First, he tells me that we are in league with DIR. He then recites a litany of falsehoods that I wish I could remember them all now. I think I posted about it once, but my memory fades. He finally tells me that GI3 hounds everyone on SB that doesn't dive DIR. I assure him that this is not the case, since I am a dedicated Stroke as well as the owner of SB and that while he's a member, GI3 has never posted on SB because of a promise he made. He just doesn't believe me. Sigh.

ScubaBoard has been and will be the best kept secret in our industry. People who are truly interested in becoming great divers find us all the time through Google. No, they aren't the average diver and I love that. We do seem to be in love with the BP& wing... except for me. I dive a BC on single tank OC. Often, it doesn't even have a bladder or a wing attached. We are the last forum standing, thanks to Facebook and even I feel the pressure from them. We could use the traffic, so please tell your friends and buddies. Us hooligans need to stick together and support each other.
 
As an aside, at my normal dive site, everyone is in a Back Plate and wing or a sidemount harness. I love Peacock Springs.
 
For much of my professional career, I kept a sign posted on the wall of my office - as a reminder for me and as food for thought for others - that was titled, 'Signs of Stagnation'. It consisted of seven bullet points:

  • 'We've never done it that way.'
  • 'We're not ready for that.'
  • 'We're doing all right without it.'
  • 'We've tried that once before.'
  • 'It costs too much.'
  • 'That's not our responsibility.'
  • 'It just won't work . . .'

In retirement (from my professional work, not from scuba instruction), I keep it on the wall in my 'scuba den' at home.

I felt my blood pressure rise just reading this list. Drives me crazy to run into people who think this way.
 
I dive a BC on single tank OC. Often, it doesn't even have a bladder or a wing attached. .

Without a bladder or wing is it really a BC ? :D
 

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