LDS vs. Internet

[DaMaDo]

I'm not saying this is right, but here's my personal take.

I buy almost everything online, not just scuba equipment. I'm even an amazon prime user. It's just much more convenient for me plus I save a lot. I usually shop the closeouts and open box items for even better deals. Sometimes it's the thrill of the hunt, which is often exacerbated by the enormous selection of items on the internet to look through. It also usually ensures that I'm not struck with buyers remorse...I've seen everything there is to see and conveniently buy online rather than making several calls to see which LDS has it in stock. I tend to want items that aren't usually widely available.

Another factor is I hate having people "wait" on me to look and make my choice. I also never buy anything without reading various reviews. When I go to buy something in a local store I'm usually very educated about the item and there's nothing to discuss - especially since I'd rather get purchase recommendations from non-biased experienced divers from a forum such as scubaboard rather than someone trying to meet a quota.

I will of course support my LDS with lots of training and boat trips. If I buy a tank it will be locally also, regardless of the online price difference. Not that the tank will make much difference to them, but I'd think all the training and dive trips should. As I live in Miami, most of my diving with be here with them.

 

[Dyno Bill]

I believe you can get most all the course work through the internet as well and just do cert dives with a lds. There shouldn't be an actual reason for anyone to go into an lds anymore. I think the internet has changed the way the world does business, who knows if it's for better or worse but it has completely changed it. I personally still but nails at my local Ace hardware and get car parts at the local Napa store and so on and so on. I like to talk to someone when I buy something from them and ask a question or two. Heck we still have chairs on our front lawn and say hi when our neighbors walk in the evening, of course we are usually having a gin and tonic at the time.

 

[svnipp]

So Dyno, where do you get air fills and equipment service? Personally, I plan to pop into Scuba Toys once a month or so just to browse. I never know what might catch my eye in a place with that kind of selection. Shopping online however tends to be more of knowing what I'm looking for and hunting it down.

Personally, I would much rather have an in person course as I get more out of that kind of instruction than coursework over the Internet. I plan to do all of my training through my LDS whether there are training dives with the class in question or not.

 

[Dyno Bill]

So Dyno, where do you get air fills and equipment service? Personally, I plan to pop into Scuba Toys once a month or so just to browse. I never know what might catch my eye in a place with that kind of selection. Shopping online however tends to be more of knowing what I'm looking for and hunting it down.

Personally, I would much rather have an in person course as I get more out of that kind of instruction than coursework over the Internet. I plan to do all of my training through my LDS whether there are training dives with the class in question or not.

I still do business with a small local store the owner has had for 30 years. He's really struggling to stay in business there as it has slowed dramatically. I buy my flashlight batteries from him just to be proactive. you know like put your money type stuff. The tanks I don't use anymore, I still have them VIP there and get them refilled every so often just cause. He has lent me more gear over the years because I had a need. I imagine he will be gone sooner than later as it is business. Sorry if I was misleading in my post but I don't buy from an internet provider, mostly because I already own more gear than I could use in a day and none of it is very new with exception of a freedive mask I bought last year

 

[fjpatrum]

I have the option of a lot of LDSes around me. I researched them through phone calls and some in-store stops and found one I liked. When it came time to finish up my certification dives (via referral) the shop I liked turned out not to have a good schedule for me. I used my second "favorite" shop. I took my reg (purchased used) to the first shop to get it serviced and they came back with a price about $40 higher than what they had quoted me, though in their defense that was the price of parts kits, which they suggested probably wasn't going to be necessary. Then I went in to look at knives/cutters and lights. They didn't have a very good selection and the best support I've gotten from them was a discussion with the owner over the phone about reg servicing. Every time I've been in the actual shop, the support I've received hasn't been great. On the other hand my "second favorite" shop has better accessory selection, and a smaller wetsuit and fin selection (neither of which I need) but have been outstanding as far as support. I've since made my "second favorite" my primary shop because I receive much better support from them. In return, I support them significantly more. I've taken tanks in for servicing, bought some small items (lights and cutters) from them and will probably take some classes through them in the future. They know my name even though I've only been in the shop maybe 10 times over the last 4 months.

All that said, really expensive gear I will buy online because I simply can't afford to "carry" the shop on my wallet. I buy little things at twice the price I can find them online because I think it's worth it but $500 is enough to justify spending online versus in the shop. Big ticket items in the future I will either talk with the shop owners/manager to see if they can come close to online prices, or I will simply buy online. Obviously they treat me like a valued customer now and I appreciate that. In return, I recommend them to other people and I will do my training and accessory purchases through them.

 

[scubadobadoo]

If your dive shop wants to stay in business then they will match or come close to internet prices. It's a global economy so the idea of "local" has changed and so must the LDS. It seems harsh, but it's reality. Besides, most LDS's I have been in don't have what I want to buy anyway but they can order it online for me and mark up the price significantly. Honestly, the day a Wal Mart employee harasses me about shopping at Target is the day I will spend 50% more at a LDS.

 

[scubafanatic]

Yeah... Scuba Toys is pretty great. Walking into there shop in Dallas was a real eye opener. They literally had stuff hanging from the rafters, and the place wasn't small to begin with. I was also impressed with the guy who was helping me get geared up, and even though I was buying an awesome package he still threw in about $65 worth of free stuff. I will definitely be going back there for more gear, but I'll also be sticking closer to home to support the LDS on my side of town especially for things like training.

One shop here in the area that I went to though the manager about chewed my head off for just mentioning LeisurePro. That was the first and will be the last time I ever visit that shop. This really should be a lesson for the LDSs. The Internet is here to stay, and being abusive to your customers for shopping around is not the way to earn new customers or repeat business.

I personally know of 2 Dallas/Ft. Worth area dive shops that will essentially ban you from their shops if they find out you're buying from the likes of Leisurepro or Scubatoys, they will give you a VERY strong lecture about how naughty you're being !

 

[Dyno Bill]

Some years back I worked at a dealership running a chassis dyno. People would come and have me diagnose a problem they had and then take it to an independent shop to get it repaired in an attempt to save money, really pissed me off as a good portion of my salary came from the repair and not just the diagnosis so when I could identify clients playing that game I literally stood on them with both feet. A diagnosis that I might have done for an hours labor charge got trumped up to maybe 2.5 hours. The key was i ran the only dyno in town and the cars needed then for accurate diagnosis and adjustments. Thats why I feel the way I do about this particular issue, I'm sure if I needed something bigger I could get a fair deal with the past I have with the shop.

 

[scubafanatic]

If your dive shop wants to stay in business then they will match or come close to internet prices. It's a global economy so the idea of "local" has changed and so must the LDS. It seems harsh, but it's reality. Besides, most LDS's I have been in don't have what I want to buy anyway but they can order it online for me and mark up the price significantly. Honestly, the day a Wal Mart employee harasses me about shopping at Target is the day I will spend 50% more at a LDS.

It always trips me out when the LDS has to order stuff for me, which makes their existance completely pointless! DUH! Essentially there are, for me, only 2 compelling reasons to buy from the " ma-an'-pa " LDS......to maintain the warranty 'blackmail', OR the manufacturer maintains a strong hold on their brand (for example, try and find Halcyon stuff on sale anywhere...good luck with that! .....I settle for a standard 10% discount locally on Halcyon, which essentially covers the extra I pay for local sales tax.)

 

[jonnythan]

Here's what you do. Go to your LDS and talk to them about the equipment you want (really pick their brains, try everything on, if you can, go in the pool with the BC and regulator system you want, spend hours of the shops time). Remember your LDS has lot of expertise and you should use it!
Then go back on line and buy all of your gear. Don't ask the LDS to match prices (they have over head compressor, filtration, air certifications, electric bills, water bills, accountants, state tax, city tax (business licenses, alarm tax, fire department inspections), federal tax, instructor dues, insurance(building insurance, instructor insurance, store liability insurance, truck insurance, health insurance, etc. they will never be able to match prices).
It's all about the best deal. It's all about you.
If you want to make the shop happy buy an Al tank from them and get them to throw in 20 free air fills.
After 27 years in the business I have come to the conclusion that "divers are the cheapest SOB's on the planet". I'm so happy to be retired and out of retail. I really feel for the brick and mortar shops they are just hanging on by their finger nails. I'm afraid that the LDS are dying and when they die so will this sport(but you have to remember it's all about the deal. It's all about you).

I think this is my favorite type of post on SB. It's so rabidly anti-consumer, anti-capitalist, elitist, and entitled I can't help but laugh. Of course, then I want to cry because these are the types of customer-floggers that run the "industry".