In the case I described on the dyno, the customer didn't have to ask my for my help. He could have bought his own dyno and buy a building to put it in, maybe 100-150 grand. Then of course there is the learning curve, it only took me 8 years to learn and by that time another 6 years perfecting my skills and you don't feel I had a right to expect payment for my services...... or did I misunderstand something. I wasn't running a burger King and he didn't get it his way, or at least thats how I remembered it
LDS vs. Internet
- Thread starter DayBob
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In the case I described on the dyno, the customer didn't have to ask my for my help. He could have bought his own dyno and buy a building to put it in, maybe 100-150 grand. Then of course there is the learning curve, it only took me 8 years to learn and by that time another 6 years perfecting my skills and you don't feel I had a right to expect payment for my services...... or did I misunderstand something. I wasn't running a burger King and he didn't get it his way, or at least thats how I remembered it
Or you could have charged an appropriate price for the dyno service, instead of charging a low price and then simply hoping that the customer returns and gets the recommended services from you, thus subsidizing your dyno, instead of going to the free market for them.
See, you say "you don't feel I had a right to expect payment for my services...." But you did get payment for your services. The customer paid you your own asking price for the services you provided. If you don't feel your own asking price is sufficient, and the customer needs to make up the difference to you in other ways, that's your problem. Not his.
Chastising the customer as a business owner for opting to save money with another servicer is, frankly, ridiculous.
I just wrapped up my OW Cert on Sunday with an LDS. I chose this shop because they took the time to answer all my questions and had all the equipment I could need to pass OW for rent at a negligible cost. More importantly, their full selection of masks and snorkels were all available to try out before they are purchased. In fact this LDS discouraged buying a mask before it was tried out. All the other Shops in my area required the purchase of Mask/Fins/Snorkel before the first confined dive. The shop I chose is a small Mom and Pop, but in my first visit I met the owners and they took the time to answer the mountain of questions I had.
Furthermore, the LDS is cheaper that a vast majority (in some cases cheaper period) than any other sources I found on the net. Most major MFGs will protect their dealers and most of the prices floating around the net are MSRP. This shop is significantly lower in cost.
Finally, if I ever have any problems... I have someone to deal with. Someone whom I have a professional consumer relationship with. It is without a doubt the best deal all around out there for me. Not to mention, from what I see... diving is a community. There is no better way for initial introductions to other knowledgeable divers while avoiding mentally deranged diving buddies at random from the internet.
Furthermore, the LDS is cheaper that a vast majority (in some cases cheaper period) than any other sources I found on the net. Most major MFGs will protect their dealers and most of the prices floating around the net are MSRP. This shop is significantly lower in cost.
Finally, if I ever have any problems... I have someone to deal with. Someone whom I have a professional consumer relationship with. It is without a doubt the best deal all around out there for me. Not to mention, from what I see... diving is a community. There is no better way for initial introductions to other knowledgeable divers while avoiding mentally deranged diving buddies at random from the internet.
scubadobadoo
Contributor
Nobody wants to see a business (in reality a family) fail so please take my comments with that in mind. That said, small businesses generally fail due to problems that frequently include bad location, low demand for products, lack of products, a bad business model, and bad management. Most of the LDS's I have been in suffer from at least 3 of the above off the bat on the day they open.
If someone opens a small dive shop in the middle of Ohio then they should likely be checked for sanity because they already likely suffer from FOUR of the above issues I mentioned. I'll assume they are the nicest most professional people in the world and that they have decent prices.:blinking: If that same LDS then complains about the internet killing them, well I can't help them no matter how much over priced stuff I buy from them or how nice or cool they are.
I feel for them, honestly I do but just because they are a small business doesn't mean they get an excuse for making a bad career choice. That's kinda like an actor blaming the world because they never became the next Brad Pitt. The odds for having a continually profitable LDS are very low, maybe lower than becoming the next Brad Pitt.
So the real question is why in the heck would anyone open a small LDS in Ohio this economy in the first place?
Btw, the fact that we are having this discussion on the internet doesn't do much for the above LDS. It does however point out that we live in a different world than we used to and "local" has a new definition.
I wish all the LDS's good luck and I hope they survive but they are up against a wall for sure in this global economy.
If someone opens a small dive shop in the middle of Ohio then they should likely be checked for sanity because they already likely suffer from FOUR of the above issues I mentioned. I'll assume they are the nicest most professional people in the world and that they have decent prices.:blinking: If that same LDS then complains about the internet killing them, well I can't help them no matter how much over priced stuff I buy from them or how nice or cool they are.
I feel for them, honestly I do but just because they are a small business doesn't mean they get an excuse for making a bad career choice. That's kinda like an actor blaming the world because they never became the next Brad Pitt. The odds for having a continually profitable LDS are very low, maybe lower than becoming the next Brad Pitt.
So the real question is why in the heck would anyone open a small LDS in Ohio this economy in the first place?
Btw, the fact that we are having this discussion on the internet doesn't do much for the above LDS. It does however point out that we live in a different world than we used to and "local" has a new definition.
I wish all the LDS's good luck and I hope they survive but they are up against a wall for sure in this global economy.
Id have to say I agree that its important to have an LDS for tank fills and for obtaining service on equipment but I have been to so many dive shops that instead of working with the customer they try to rip them off. One shop I know chose a location that is well known to be a high land tax area. (I think small shops pay as much as 50 thousand a year or better here). since you cant dive in the middle of a town with the nearest dive site an hour away it just made better since to me to choose a more affordable location rather then inflate cost and make the consumer pay for it.
Another problem I have seen is so many dive shops and believe it or not dive masters brag about trips all over the world and post photos of destinations that can easily exceed 20 thousand dollars to goto and since this is their primary source of income who do you think is paying for those trips?
Also so many of the major brands like aqualung choose to mark up msrp to rediculous prices and require all LDS to sale them as such prices or risk loosing the right to sale their products. Thats not free market nor fair to the average diver.
I went to a dive shop once and was quoted a stainless steele knife at 60 dollars yet went online and found the exact same style of knife only in Titanium for 40 dollars. Is this not gouging or what?
Another problem I have seen is so many dive shops and believe it or not dive masters brag about trips all over the world and post photos of destinations that can easily exceed 20 thousand dollars to goto and since this is their primary source of income who do you think is paying for those trips?
Also so many of the major brands like aqualung choose to mark up msrp to rediculous prices and require all LDS to sale them as such prices or risk loosing the right to sale their products. Thats not free market nor fair to the average diver.
I went to a dive shop once and was quoted a stainless steele knife at 60 dollars yet went online and found the exact same style of knife only in Titanium for 40 dollars. Is this not gouging or what?
There are as many opinions as there are people that have them. As for the shops being here if the future, some will and some won't. It likely wont have as much effect on my pursuits as those of others as I'm sorta out of the acquisition mode. I think really good deals are nice to find and hope everyone gets a chance to have the gear they feel suits there style of diving.
Nobody wants to see a business (in reality a family) fail so please take my comments with that in mind. That said, small businesses generally fail due to problems that frequently include bad location, low demand for products, lack of products, a bad business model, and bad management. Most of the LDS's I have been in suffer from at least 3 of the above off the bat on the day they open.
If someone opens a small dive shop in the middle of Ohio then they should likely be checked for sanity because they already likely suffer from FOUR of the above issues I mentioned. I'll assume they are the nicest most professional people in the world and that they have decent prices.:blinking: If that same LDS then complains about the internet killing them, well I can't help them no matter how much over priced stuff I buy from them or how nice or cool they are.
I feel for them, honestly I do but just because they are a small business doesn't mean they get an excuse for making a bad career choice. That's kinda like an actor blaming the world because they never became the next Brad Pitt. The odds for having a continually profitable LDS are very low, maybe lower than becoming the next Brad Pitt.
So the real question is why in the heck would anyone open a small LDS in Ohio this economy in the first place?
Btw, the fact that we are having this discussion on the internet doesn't do much for the above LDS. It does however point out that we live in a different world than we used to and "local" has a new definition.
I wish all the LDS's good luck and I hope they survive but they are up against a wall for sure in this global economy.
LOL, why would anyone in the middle of the country own scuba gear........ the ocean is quite a trip from Ohio
You know, there's water on the surface of the earth that is not contained in the ocean.
Here's your sign.
Illustrates well that there are two types of people in this thread and involved in retail scuba - people with experience of working in the industry and people without that experience. The reality is that times are extremely hard for people in the dive industry. Many have already gone out of business, which in most cases represents a personal tragedy, and the vast majority will follow. The one remaining retail outlet in this resort town (there used to be four) is struggling and quite likely will not survive much beyond the end of this year.
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