New Divers Beware: Sketchy dive shop in Cozumel puts profits over safety

[Thalassamania]

Students should not be placed in the dilemma of doing what is right (going up or surfacing alone) vs. doing what is right (staying with their buddy).

 

[robint]

The big problem I see here is that the Instructor was not instructing, he was acting as a dive guide. Instructors cannot do both, particularly in drift diving locations like Cozumel.

Don't expect PADI to do anything about it. It is a he said, he said argument. I have seen instructors do much much worse things who didn't even get notified by PADI that a complaint was filed against them.

The Dive Op was at fault here, IMHO. The instructor should have been with his student 100%, and a DM should have been with the other divers. If that had happened, the student would have gone up to surface with his buddy, the instructor, and resolved the issue.

 

[Karibelle]

Don't expect PADI to do anything about it. It is a he said, he said argument. I have seen instructors do much much worse things who didn't even get notified by PADI that a complaint was filed against them.

While that may be true, the instructor certainly won't be notified by PADI (or whoever his training agency is) if nothing is said. Complaining on the internet is not an effective way to get anything changed.

All my students leave my class with my business card and the telephone number at PADI and an invitation to call them (PADI) if they have any concerns about their training.

 

[travelpro]

The guy was doing is OW course. Sounds like poor instruction rather than putting all the responsibility on the student.

If it were me, I would not have done the dive in this case if instruction was not the objective ...like the instructor also being a DM for other divers.

And if it were me, and speaking from experience, if I could not equalize and the DM (or instructor in this case) continued to signal me to descend as he descended after my proper signaling multiple times of my issue, Id give him the double middle finger signal for ignoring my issue then the double thumbs up and surface.

 

[DevonDiver]

The big problem I see here is that the Instructor was not instructing, he was acting as a dive guide.

What instruction happens on Open Water dives?

Student plans and conducts dives, under supervision. Having previously demonstrated mastery of skills, the student is asked to replicate/repeat those skills on the dives.

Instructor provides supervision, in line with his duty-of-care. Instructor/DM has similar duty-of-care as a supervisor of qualified divers.

The only real issue here is one of buddy separation. Assuming that the instructor was the student's nominated buddy. In which case, we have to question whether effective buddy procedures (most importantly distancing) were applied. Given that we don't know the distancing, or actual movements of the divers, then all else is speculative, based on a very emotionally charged, negatively motivated and relatively inaccurate report.

 

[Ron Lee]

Geez, instruction or skill set checkout? Yes there is a difference but if the events are as stated by the poster, seems the instructor did not do what was required.

I am not an instructor but if the stated events are factual....it was not acceptable in my opinion.

 

[jerk85]

...based on a very emotionally charged, negatively motivated and relatively inaccurate report.

How would any of us know if his report was inaccurate?

 

[robint]

What instruction happens on Open Water dives?

Student plans and conducts dives, under supervision. Having previously demonstrated mastery of skills, the student is asked to replicate/repeat those skills on the dives.

Instructor provides supervision, in line with his duty-of-care. Instructor/DM has similar duty-of-care as a supervisor of qualified divers.

The only real issue here is one of buddy separation. Assuming that the instructor was the student's nominated buddy. In which case, we have to question whether effective buddy procedures (most importantly distancing) were applied. Given that we don't know the distancing, or actual movements of the divers, then all else is speculative, based on a very emotionally charged, negatively motivated and relatively inaccurate report.

Until the certification is complete, the instructor is supposed to be instructing, the student is still a student and does not plan a dive. PADI instructors are not supposed to leave a student in the water, for any reason, until the certification course is done.
My husband is an active instructor here locally. If one student has ear problems (or any other problem) on decent, then ALL students must get back out of the water and wait while he gets that one student out of the water and safely on shore before he returns. Then ALL the remaining students go back down in the water. It sucks, especially if it is cold, but it is the rule. The only exception is if he has an AI or DM working with him who can escort the student out of the water, then the instructor can watch stay with the group in the water.
Do all instructors follow this rule all the time?? I am sure not. But it is the standard.

robin

 

[Jim Lapenta]

We have no idea what the classroom training for this person was like. But based on the scenario he presents I'd have to say it sucked. Big time. Otherwise he would have known to insist on ascending and refused to follow the "instructor". I use the term loosely since a real instructor would not have taken him to that depth on OW checkout dives. If this was also his pool and classroom instructor both were at fault and IMO neither had any business in open water. The instructor doesn't seem to care about standards, the student does not seem to grasp how important it is to equalize and if unable to do so stop the descent. He also does not know that a diver can call a dive at any time and no excuse is required.

If the poster does not have the skill set as noted in Ron Lee's post to ascend alone when the instructor disregards the not able to equalize sign he has no business doing checkout dives. I have had on more than a few occaisions a student tell me he or she could not equalize as we were descending and at that point everything stops. No discussion, it stops. We ascend a few feet and try again slower. If they still cannot equalize the dive is over and that student is escorted out of the water and safely to shore or the boat. Anything else is completely unacceptable and dangerous. I have seen other instructors watch as a student gets almost to shore, then turn and descend to join the rest of their group. At that point on two occasions the student for some unknown reason decided to try and go back down on their own. Both times I was able to stop them and see they got out of the water. I then went and told their instructor.

Even more evidence that the OP is not ready to hold a c- card is that the instructor supposedly made him do a second dive. BULL CRAP! Unless he had a gun on him there was no excuse for him choosing to do the next dive. That shows very poor judgment and until that is rectified by more classroom and pool training the OP should stay out of the water.

Of course it was Cozumel where this happened. Could have been anywhere. But based on the reputation the area has why anyone would choose to do OW training there and most especially referral dives is nuts. They are known for not following the rules, recommendations, or standards. The fact that they send lots of money to certain agencies seems to insure that the agency will take no disciplinary action, will not publicly scold the shop or instructor to at least give the impression that they care about these violations, and do not advise their general membership to warn students about the propensity for some Cozumel ops to do whatever they please. A perfect opportunity to show some guts was lost when they did not come out with a public statement condemning the practices of some "professionals" that killed one and crippled another.

I train my students to research and know where they are going and what to do if someone does something they are not ok with. Including myself. I have little tests I will use with students on OW checkouts where I expect them to tell me no and, if necessary, give me a one finger salute coupled with no! I openly advise new OW students to not go to Cozumel. We do not have any real opportunity for drift diving locally so before they decide to do it I advise them to get some experience in a more benign drift setting and work up to Cozumel or to get 20 or 30 dives in and really have their skills nailed before going there. I also tell them to not trust the DM's or guides with their safety. Even on checkout dives the student, unless they know the instructor really well and the standards really well, to take responsibility for themselves. It is not hard to do. You just have to address it and reinforce it in training early and often.

I will thank the OP for giving me another example to use. As to student mistakes, instructor mistakes, and why Cozumel is not an ideal place for a new diver.

 

[Thalassamania]

What instruction happens on Open Water dives?

Student plans and conducts dives, under supervision. Having previously demonstrated mastery of skills, the student is asked to replicate/repeat those skills on the dives.

Instructor provides supervision, in line with his duty-of-care. Instructor/DM has similar duty-of-care as a supervisor of qualified divers.

The only real issue here is one of buddy separation. Assuming that the instructor was the student's nominated buddy. In which case, we have to question whether effective buddy procedures (most importantly distancing) were applied. Given that we don't know the distancing, or actual movements of the divers, then all else is speculative, based on a very emotionally charged, negatively motivated and relatively inaccurate report.

The instructor appears to have violated his duty-of-care with respect to the student. I would argue that while the Instructor/DM has similar duty-of-care as a supervisor of qualified divers, his or her first and foremost duty-of-care must go to the student. It appears that the instructor was the student's "nominated" buddy (now there's a term of art that I've not seen before) so that also an issue. This incident demands a complaint to PADI.