ElectricZombie
Contributor
I will advise that if you are out just diving for fun, never tell anyone that you are an Instructor/DM. Only show them your Basic or Advanced card, nothing higher.
Professional liability when diving with friends
- Thread starter Northeastwrecks
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:bonk:
I feel us sinking into the morass of tort arguements but let me offer this tip: There is a tort and agency doctrine dealing with
the "indicia of authority." What that means is that if you look like a duck [DM,Instructor,etc] Quack [talk]like a duck, and act like a duck people are entitled to assume you are a duck.
When I taught EMTs I had to warn them about people mistaking them for doctors. When you wear a white lab coat, have tongue depressors in your pocket and hang around a hospital people mistake you for a doc. You have the "indicia of authority." The same way if you dressed in a police uniform. People assume your are a doc or a cop. For divers if you talk like a DM, act like a DM, others may assume you are a DM, or Instructor. If you don't tell them differently. If you have the indicia of authority and act like you have that authority YOU WILL BE HELD TO THE SAME STANDARD OF KNOWLEDGE AND PERFORMANCE AS THE PERSON YOU ARE PRETENDING TO BE. You can't say "hey, I didn't know. I'm not a divemaster" Don't act like you're somthing you arn't!
I feel us sinking into the morass of tort arguements but let me offer this tip: There is a tort and agency doctrine dealing with
the "indicia of authority." What that means is that if you look like a duck [DM,Instructor,etc] Quack [talk]like a duck, and act like a duck people are entitled to assume you are a duck.
When I taught EMTs I had to warn them about people mistaking them for doctors. When you wear a white lab coat, have tongue depressors in your pocket and hang around a hospital people mistake you for a doc. You have the "indicia of authority." The same way if you dressed in a police uniform. People assume your are a doc or a cop. For divers if you talk like a DM, act like a DM, others may assume you are a DM, or Instructor. If you don't tell them differently. If you have the indicia of authority and act like you have that authority YOU WILL BE HELD TO THE SAME STANDARD OF KNOWLEDGE AND PERFORMANCE AS THE PERSON YOU ARE PRETENDING TO BE. You can't say "hey, I didn't know. I'm not a divemaster" Don't act like you're somthing you arn't!
DivePartner1
Contributor
I think there is something to this, but it's not the whole story. Large or scandalous judgments make the news. Reversals, remittiturs or settlements on appeal do not. Also, I agree that recreational divers have a pretty low risk profile. But this is not a phantom issue. The annual list of the largest verdicts and settlements in Texas always makes cchilling reading.
An LDS only needs to on the receiving end of claim in excess of its insurance to be in the realm of company-killing litigation. Those of us who don't do it for money are more at risk driving to the dive--both for safety and litigation risk.
Let me give you some good news:
1. A little secret of tort litigation is no insurance no suit. Plaintiffs only want insurance money. It's just too difficult to get money from defendants. They don't have much after paying leins, they go bankrupt, and it costs too much, and it takes too long.
2. In Michigan The Great Lake State, there has never been a reported case over recreational diving. I searched Westlaw, the computer research system and there is NOTHING. That doesn't mean no cases, just none that have ever gone past Circuit Court to the Court of Appeals or Supremes. Other states may have cases but if a water state like Michigan doesn't , there can't be very many of them nationwide.
3. To elaborate on #1-in lawsuits a plaintiff usually offers to settle "within policy limits." This puts tremendous pressure on the insurance company and they usually settle or face a "bad faith" suit from the insured.
Thats IT for litigation 101-I quit
1. A little secret of tort litigation is no insurance no suit. Plaintiffs only want insurance money. It's just too difficult to get money from defendants. They don't have much after paying leins, they go bankrupt, and it costs too much, and it takes too long.
2. In Michigan The Great Lake State, there has never been a reported case over recreational diving. I searched Westlaw, the computer research system and there is NOTHING. That doesn't mean no cases, just none that have ever gone past Circuit Court to the Court of Appeals or Supremes. Other states may have cases but if a water state like Michigan doesn't , there can't be very many of them nationwide.
3. To elaborate on #1-in lawsuits a plaintiff usually offers to settle "within policy limits." This puts tremendous pressure on the insurance company and they usually settle or face a "bad faith" suit from the insured.
Thats IT for litigation 101-I quit
Spectre
Contributor
Who determines what the duck walks, looks, and talks like?
KKMatt and Raxafarian can attest to the time a cop saw the three of us flipping through our logbooks, and decided to accuse me of running a class without a permit...
Spectre
Contributor
Uh....
You know, the more I participate on forums, the more I see what a GD waste of time these pissing matches are. That's not a comment directed at you, Spectre. I've enjoyed reading your posts. Just a general observation that's off topic.
I've got too much "surface tension" right now.
I'll see you guys --snip-- tomorrow.
Scott
I've got too much "surface tension" right now.
I'll see you guys --snip-- tomorrow.
Scott
The Chairman
Chairman of the Board
is arguably the BEST advice anyone has given on this board!!! Thanks!
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