Recreational Sidemount ...

[Jeff_S]

As an agency, we released a UTD broad-based side mount program in 2010. This was after years of "monkey diving," tech diving with stages, rebreather diving with bailout on the side, etc.

The most important thing was to make side mount consistent across the board: recreational, technical, and overhead. This led to two important innovations: the Z-System distribution block and the Z-Isolator manifold which, in turn, led to a side mount system that is completely scaleable. In other words, we can dive a single side mount tank, double side mount tanks, doubles with deco, etc., and nothing changes...just carry and plug in the appropriate bottles. For deco, it's no more complicated than any gas switch. For recreational, take one, or two bottle as the dive calls for. If I'm doing a shallow reef dive, I take one bottle. If I'm at 60-100'/18-30m, I can take two. Deeper, I can take any number of deco bottles, and all the while I continue to breathe from the donatable long hose and have the necklace for backup. No independent doubles, no time spent on the non-donatable neckace, and I'm in the exact same configuration as anyone diving back mount with a long hose and necklace.

So the system is scaleable (any number of bottles) and compatible (same hose configuration as back mount singles or doubles).

For training, we offer a variety of Essentials classes in side mount. These carry all the same personal skills as our back mount Essentials classes, but in side mount. The student can take Essentials of Rec, Tech, or Overhead, and all that changes is the number of bottles and training on drills and potential failures, same as back mount.

The other part of the training revolves around gear fitting. One of the issues with side mount, especially if using a harness system rather than a backplate, is that everything has to fit, or the bottles will not hang properly. So that's a big part of the class.

We also offer side mount mini's for students who want to add side mount at their current level...again this can be rec, tech, or overhead.

I think the training is more important than the gear. Any time anyone goes to a new system, it is just good diving practice to learn to use it properly.

Jeff

 

[victorzamora]

Someone has finally gotten to the meat of the issue. Do we need to issue a card for ANY REAL REASON

I think this is different. I think that narrowing it to liability may be a little too specific. For example: There may not be a legal liability reason for it, but if you (as a commercial boat owner) require one for sidemount diving, then I want one to be issued to me. I don't own a boat, and you've said some things that make me concerned as far as pushback from boat operators that I have no perspective on. I will say that if a shore diving site or cave diving site required me to have a sidemount card to dive sidemount there, I wouldn't be happy. If they wanted a sidemount card to dive there AT ALL (like a super-restrictive cave) then that's different, kinda like DPV cert required in Manatee.

One big problem with SM cert cards is the instructor, and the failings of the student. Like I said, I've seen Full Cave students being trained by Full Cave instructors, both in sidemount and both with bad technique. I have seen more than a couple SM instructors fail miserably on boats. I have no SM cert, and I'm far from perfect, and I was much more put together than they were. Once we hopped in the water, nothing changed. I'm not saying I'm perfect, or even that I'm really good, but I care about the little things. There are too many instructors that have 4 dives in SM and then start teaching it, and you get those hot messes trouncing around everywhere claiming they're sidemounters. My point is that good mentorship is MUCH better than thousands of dollars on bad instruction and certification.

Here's my question: If you (generality) start requiring SM certs, are you going to start requiring BM certs?

 

[flots am]

The most important thing was to make side mount consistent across the board: recreational, technical, and overhead. This led to two important innovations: the Z-System distribution block and the Z-Isolator manifold which, in turn, led to a side mount system that is completely scaleable.

Why would you want a manifold on sidemount?

flots.

 

[victorzamora]

Why would you want a manifold on sidemount?

To sell your expensive class and manifold, to set yourself apart, to add failure points, and to keep discussions like this going. PLEASE let's let it end there. We had one pro comment, one neutral comment, and one negative comment. We've got the trifecta and we need to keep this discussion OFF the manifold system.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Here's my question: If you (generality) start requiring SM certs, are you going to start requiring BM certs?

We already do that, Victor, in that when someone is certified OW, it is assumed (up until recently) that they were certified to use a backmounted single cylinder.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[flots am]

To sell your expensive class and manifold, to set yourself apart, to add failure points, and to keep discussions like this going. PLEASE let's let it end there. We had one pro comment, one neutral comment, and one negative comment. We've got the trifecta and we need to keep this discussion OFF the manifold system.

All I could think of was bolting a trailer hitch to a Ferrarri.

It was just so weird adding a manifold.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

All I could think of was bolting a trailer hitch to a Ferrarri.

It was just so weird adding a manifold.

... that's a discussion for another thread ... there's one already that was recently active here. Let's keep this discussion focused on the certification issue, and not the configuration ... please!

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[victorzamora]

Bob, sorry, I meant for backmounted doubles....not a BM single tank.

I think it's a valid point. Diving backmounted doubles, independent or manifolded, has its own unique set of skills and challenges that could end badly for the boat owner or diver. I think sidemount is no different. I also think that anyone with about 10 minutes can get in the water close enough to either to say they're diving doubles or sidemount without being NEARLY "up to snuff." I know I'd have a hard time in doubles if you loaned me a set right now....especially on a boat or in an overhead situation with failures. However, I'm technically certified to dive them.

 

[Wookie]

Bob, sorry, I meant for backmounted doubles....not a BM single tank.

I think it's a valid point. Diving backmounted doubles, independent or manifolded, has its own unique set of skills and challenges that could end badly for the boat owner or diver. I think sidemount is no different. I also think that anyone with about 10 minutes can get in the water close enough to either to say they're diving doubles or sidemount without being NEARLY "up to snuff." I know I'd have a hard time in doubles if you loaned me a set right now....especially on a boat or in an overhead situation with failures. However, I'm technically certified to dive them.

Simple answer to your question is that we do not allow doubles in any configuration on recreational dive charters. I have made an exception once for a diver who was trained OW on sidemount and had never dived (diven?) backmount, we gave her 40's, and she knew that she would be more limited on gas than a diver on an 80, and she knew her buoyancy would be screwed, as 40's are floaty when empty. The rest of our terms stood, she had to get in and out of the water fully kitted. Her trip was a success. The 40s aren't heavy enough to throw balance off when walking on the deck, and it was the configuration she was certified in. We allow sidemount doubles on AN/DP charters where everyone knows the limitations of the configuration.

To be perfectly clear, I have nothing against sidemount on technical and tech lite (AN/DP) charters. We require a solo card and proper solo configuration for solo divers because the insurance company requires it. Sidemount is an unknown entity. I haven't asked the insurance company, nor do I intend to, because we don't allow recreational doubles in any configuration anyway.

Just to stir the pot, lets take a recreational newbie that got certified on a Mk VI. Then they got a solo card (requirements are 100 dives and advanced) using the mark VI. Solo rebreather goes against everything a training agency teaches, but SDI doesn't specify gear limitations to open circuit for the solo card. Our 100 dive wonder has a Mark VI, offboard bailout, a SMB and reel with backup. Will I let them dive solo?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

... for those (if any) still interested in the original topic ... what do you believe should be taught in a sidemount class at the recreational level ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)