Reg thats easy for parts and self repair yet good performer?

[ams511]

Agree with this perspective. My wife used one. It performed very badly on a deep stressful current dive. She got a Scubapro. Years later I thought I'd clean it up and possibly use or sell it. Found a LOT of saltwater in the ambient chamber. No big deal, clean it up and put it to work. That's when I learned about the piston bleed plug contamination. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO CLEAN ONCE CONTAMINATED. I tried EVERYTHING. Replacement is your only option, and though the pistons look very similar across the model lines, they are not identical.They are easy to work on.

When they work right, they work fine. When I finally got the piston replaced I took it on a middling challenging current dive > worked fine. Personally I suspect the poor reputation may be based on contaminated pistons. They still breathe, just not nearly as well.

I suspect that many a piston was ruined by poor service. On the older Sherwoods the piston does not get cleaned. I am sure many a tech has tossed them in the ultrasonic with other regulator parts and contaminated the filter. Also oil on hands will contaminate it. If the tech did not perform a "bubble test" after service the pluged filter would not be discovered. The regulator will breath fine at the surface and in shallow water. After 10 feet it is like sucking golf balls through a gardern hose.

The other problem is that the first stage should not be soaked unless pressurized. The one way valve is suppose to prevent water entry but it sometimes doesn't. I was told this by the owner of a dive shop that was a master at tuning Sherwoods.

The newer models have a replaceable filter in the body so you do not need to toss the piston if it gets plugged. Also there is a laser-cut filter that can be cleaned and reused.

 

[fmerkel]

I suspect my wife's was probably ruined by the shop the sold, then serviced it the first time. I don't know that, but when I opened it up it was the first time I'd ever been inside it.

 

[KeithG]

I suspect that many a piston was ruined by poor service. On the older Sherwoods the piston does not get cleaned. I am sure many a tech has tossed them in the ultrasonic with other regulator parts and contaminated the filter. Also oil on hands will contaminate it. If the tech did not perform a "bubble test" after service the pluged filter would not be discovered. The regulator will breath fine at the surface and in shallow water. After 10 feet it is like sucking golf balls through a gardern hose.

The other problem is that the first stage should not be soaked unless pressurized. The one way valve is suppose to prevent water entry but it sometimes doesn't. I was told this by the owner of a dive shop that was a master at tuning Sherwoods
.

My experience has been different.

The piston on one of our regs was screwed by the LDS so it did not dry bleed. It still breathed just fine at depth for several trips to the Caribbean. The plugged filter does not affect the operation of the reg other than it will allow the one way valve to collapse enough and water will enter the ambient pressure chamber. The ambient side of the piston is still at ambient pressure, it is just wet instead of dry. No change in operation of the regulator.

We have been soaking our first stages unpressurized for 30 years. The one way valve works fine in a soak tank up to 3 feet deep. It will fail if a service tech uses a screwdriver to remove the valve and scratches the sealing surface of the stage. The service manual has a bolded warning not to use a metal screwdriver or blade to remove the one way valve.

 

[KeithG]

I suspect my wife's was probably ruined by the shop the sold, then serviced it the first time. I don't know that, but when I opened it up it was the first time I'd ever been inside it.

Agreed. The service manual has a warning not to put the piston in cleaning solution or an ultrasonic cleaner as that will foul the flow control element in the piston.

The first time I opened one of our regs I discovered that the LDS service tech had packed the ambient chamber full of christo lube. No wonder the dry bleed system failed...

 

[84CJ7]

I would have done the Scubapro mk10/109 if I wanted piston regs, but for reasons I don't debate I stick with balanced diaphragm regs and already have the tools to service them. I know the parts are super generic to service a piston reg though which is nice.

I am not a diehard Conshelf fan actually, this one just just meets all my requirements and has a general design I am already familiar with working on. Hose routing might be a bit different on the various versions so some may be worse. On my "14" other than the HP and LP inflator hoses being oddly flipped top to bottom from what I am used to (why point the HP up and LP down?) and a sharp down angle on the lower hoses it seems workable for me. The MR22/Abyss I have is almost certainly a better performer too, but it costs about 4 times as much to service when you can even find all the parts for sale thanks to the fact that the tri material poppet seats and the diaphragms don't come in the kits.

 

[tech3324]

On my "14" other than the HP and LP inflator hoses being oddly flipped top to bottom from what I am used to (why point the HP up and LP down?) and a sharp down angle on the lower hoses

I never noticed that before. My main reg is an SE2 (4LP ports) and each port points exactly where you want it to go for single tank back mount. I pulled out a 14 to compare and don't like that port configuration so much.

 

[buddhasummer]

I feel the same way about the routing, it is not the best. However, my Conshelfs were setup by the dive shop for standard
open water diving. I am not sure if the routing would be better if I used proper length hoses and set it up Dive Rite style. You could also use the first stage that came with the Micra and Sea series regulators (I think it is called the Cousteau). They are pretty cheap on eBay and from what I hear are even easier to repair than a standard Conshelf first.

BTW, I have been off SB for a while. Have you guys found a source for the cheap Trident seats for the MK-5 and MK-10?

Send me a message, I can help you out.

 

[buddhasummer]

IMO it's very hard to beat a MK5 or MK10 and 109 2nd stage for great performance, easy service, and value. I'm not the huge conshelf fan that many others are on this board; I have one and I will never use it because the hose routing is so bad. They are very well made and super reliable. I just can't abide by the hose routing.

I find the hose routing (on a 14, not an XIV) with a 22" back up, 40" primary, 24" HP and a 22" BC hose to be as good as any other reg set I have, things only get really ugly if you try to add a DS hose, I don't. For better hose routing with DS and almost as simple servicing and reliability I now use an Apeks FSR which I converted to "un-overbalanced" which now has extremely stable ip across tank pressure, perfect for a conshelf second.

 

[tech3324]

I find the hose routing (on a 14, not an XIV) with a 22" back up, 40" primary, 24" HP and a 22" BC hose to be as good as any other reg set I have,

How do you get around the HP port pointing up and LP port pointing down?

 

[buddhasummer]

How do you get around the HP port pointing up and LP port pointing down?

A picture is often easier to understand than a written description, I'll post a photo this evening for you.

My hp port is parallel with the horizon, the next LP port going from right to left after hp port is unused, the next LP port parallel to the horizon is my back up hose, the next LP down is my primary the next along is my BC. I usually use 18" BC hoses with my wings but because if the ports position I had to use a 22".

Anyway, like I said, I'll post a photo tonight.