Scuba Diving Survey Results

[RJP]

Faulty premise, and one that is the underlying problem of traditional market research/survey design. The methodology that I use does't "expect" anything in particular.

The only way to find something... is to avoid the temptation to look for something else.

You make my point. The terms are not easily distinguishable, are frequently synonymous in the way they are commonly interpreted, and ambiguous. All that is being measured is the association of a specific word with diving, not the respondents actual attitude or individual experience. Perhaps nothing more than a measure of what word might best be employed in a marketing context

Your faulty premise, I think. The result of a survey is obviously never presumed, never anticipated or expected. What is a proper expectation, in fact a prerequisite if the survey is to have any validity, is that the tester and the respondent have a common understanding of the essential terminology. Otherwise the classic measure of validity is not met; the test is not measuring what it was designed to measure.

This is basic stuff, Statistics 101, means, medians, and modes; reliability and validity.



---------- Post added February 25th, 2014 at 09:26 PM ----------

Damn! And here I've wasted 25yrs doing cutting-edge marketing research... when I should have been doing basic math and statistics.

:d

Don't confuse "data" with "insights" nor "numbers" with "findings."

Emotions, attitudes, behaviors, motivators, barriers, beliefs -- the stuff of marketing -- are not logical, they are not linear, they are not formulaic. There is no mean, median, mode, or standard deviation in the type of inductive methodologies that we use. We'll leave that basic stuff to the statisticians.

"Otherwise the classic measure of validity is not met..."

Had a professor in graduate school who told us of a project that he worked on as a consultant. Client called them in to determine why a product launch - a new dog food - didn't meet their sales forecast. It wasn't even close... an abysmal failure in fact. The client was perplexed. They had done several rounds of quantitative positioning work. The brightest finance/econ modelers had performed price elasticity studies across various scenarios. Packaging was tested and refined. Ad tests were done to determine mean reach/frequency requirements. Media models quantified necessary spend levels for base, optimal, and stretch cases. Retail penetration models suggested it would be the market leader very quickly. Only one problem - which the marketing consultants figured out on the second day - the dogs didn't like it.

Marketing failure is most often rooted not in having failed to find the right answer, but rather in assuming you were asking the right question.

This is not to suggest that the basic quant stuff is not important. Merely that you cannot start there. Inductive research is intended to help you create a theory, and deductive methods can only help you validate the theory.

 

[TSandM]

The sample is certainly skewed toward professional divers . . . but I have read a number of things over the last couple of years that suggest that, in fact, the average age of scuba divers IS going up, so the age graph you have may actually represent what is happening.

 

[agilis]

Damn! And here I've wasted 25yrs doing cutting-edge marketing research... when I should have been doing basic math and statistics.

:d

Don't confuse "data" with "insights" nor "numbers" with "findings."

Emotions, attitudes, behaviors, motivators, barriers, beliefs -- the stuff of marketing -- are not logical, they are not linear, they are not formulaic. There is no mean, median, mode, or standard deviation in the type of inductive methodologies that we use. We'll leave that basic stuff to the statisticians.

"Otherwise the classic measure of validity is not met..."

Had a professor in graduate school who told us of a project that he worked on as a consultant. Client called them in to determine why a product launch - a new dog food - didn't meet their sales forecast. It wasn't even close... an abysmal failure in fact. The client was perplexed. They had done several rounds of quantitative positioning work. The brightest finance/econ modelers had performed price elasticity studies across various scenarios. Packaging was tested and refined. Ad tests were done to determine mean reach/frequency requirements. Media models quantified necessary spend levels for base, optimal, and stretch cases. Retail penetration models suggested it would be the market leader very quickly. Only one problem - which the marketing consultants figured out on the second day - the dogs didn't like it.

Marketing failure is most often rooted not in having failed to find the right answer, but rather in assuming you were asking the right question.

This is not to suggest that the basic quant stuff is not important. Merely that you cannot start there. Inductive research is intended to help you create a theory, and deductive methods can only help you validate the theory.

An entertaining anecdote, but it fails to address the issue of two words (adventure and experience) that are very close in perceived meaning to many respondents, and which overlap, in that many diving experiences, possibly all, might be seen as both an adventure and as entertaining. So which should be chosen in a survey which requires a choice between the two ambiguous words?

This results in a test of little more than two key words: which word is more frequently associated with diving experiences? The uses of this kind of information are limited, are probably connected to marketing, and are dependent on the implications of specific words mirroring those of the test designer more than those of the respondents.

Taking the survey was a rather quotidian experience, but its aftermath was a connotative experience.

 

[tajkd]

Taking the survey was a rather quotidian experience, but its aftermath was a connotative experience.

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." - Inigo Montoya

 

[Lorenzoid]

I was looking forward to learning what the "adventure/experience" question was all about. Apparently it was all about nothing :depressed: What a letdown. Oh well.

To me, an experience includes anything that I participate in. An adventure is subset of experience in which I think it's likely that something new or unexpected will happen. Eating breakfast at home was an experience but not an adventure. The egg I ate is not an experience--rather, it's a thing--but the act of eating breakfast was an experience.

There. (Why did I feel a need to share that?)

 

[mdb]

RJP:

I think you did a great survey. I was first certified @ 23 my instructors were younger.

I have attended every DEMA since the first one in Miami.

The average age of the current diver is about 44 as far as I can determine.

Actual new certification have decreased.

We have missed generation X and Y. They are off rock climbing, snowboarding etc.

You had good return on your survey. Thank you for the information.

 

[RJP]

I was looking forward to learning what the "adventure/experience" question was all about. Apparently it was all about nothing...

Why do you say that? I'm trying to avoid the temptation to "pontificate" on the results. I have encourraged people to discuss what they think the results mean. The best instructors/mentors I've ever had have "told me where to look, but not told me what to see."

Take your brain out for a spin... look at the responses and tell what you see. There are differences between the answers to some questions, so there is certainly more than "nothing" there for anyone who cares to look.

I can assure you I take something very intersting away from it. If you'd like to give it some thought and contribute to the discussion, that'd be great. If you want to huff off because you don't see a silver bullet presented to you on a platter, that's fine too. (Come back in about a week, I'm not good at resisting the temptation to pontificate for long.)

---------- Post added February 26th, 2014 at 12:02 PM ----------

An entertaining anecdote, but it fails to address the issue of two words (adventure and experience) that are very close in perceived meaning to many respondents, and which overlap, in that many diving experiences, possibly all, might be seen as both an adventure and as entertaining. So which should be chosen in a survey which requires a choice between the two ambiguous words?

This results in a test of little more than two key words: which word is more frequently associated with diving experiences? The uses of this kind of information are limited, are probably connected to marketing, and are dependent on the implications of specific words mirroring those of the test designer more than those of the respondents.

Taking the survey was a rather quotidian experience, but its aftermath was a connotative experience.

p<.0001

 

[beaverdivers]

Thanks for sharing your fine efforts.

 

[RJP]

Thanks for sharing your fine efforts.

What thoughts/implications do you see? Any particular questions based on the findings? Your perspective as a retailer/shop owner would be interesting for all, I'm sure.

Thanks!

 

[agilis]

p<.0001

[/QUOTE]

I think your suggestion of a null hypothesis is most appropriate. Evidently you were looking for marketing strategies based on text. Give it up. You are unqualified, even in connection with this kind of crude subliminal manipulation. Stick to sales.

---------- Post added February 26th, 2014 at 12:55 PM ----------

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." - Inigo Montoya

And what word(s) might that be? Associated meanings? "Survey"? "Only Virtue"? "Enthusiasm"? implicit extensions? The wishful thinking of fundamentally parochial clowns?

'Experience' underlined and set off in spurious quotes, much like a valley girl's substitution of emphasis and eye-rolling for precise language? You realize this only works for the spoken word.

Perhaps that survey should have been oral. It would have worked better because the subtle differences in key words could have been implied through some sort of mini-street theater.

A suggested company motto: "That is not what I meant at all. That is not what I meant at all"

TS Eliot