Should Shearwater add Air Integration to its computers?

[BoltSnap]

They could just make a Ai rec dive computer under a different brand name. Preserve their brand name for tech divers. Sell a similar rec oriented unit to the larger rec market as a rec brand.

Caterpillar's little power generators are sold under a different brand name. Because Cat's little generators are garbage.

1. Divers don't want to buy "garbage"

2. Divers want this specific brand name with all of what it offers including features, algorithm, etc, EVERYTHING including AI.

3. This company ain't a "caterpillar" and it can't afford the budget and the huge financial, human, marketing, sales, market size, etc. resources that Caterpillar has and can afford.

4. People do NOT want a watered down version, they want this computer but with AI from this company with the same quality, support and brand name.

 

[Buliwyf]

So the only debate is: Can they add a selectable Ai and air int, without messing up the rest of the computer, and alienating their base?

I don't get why tech divers would not like at least having the option. Turn it off if it's not wanted, right?

 

[dmaziuk]

So the only debate is: Can they add a selectable Ai and air int, without messing up the rest of the computer

The answer, as usual, is it depends. If all you do is display tank pressure on the screen, then "messing up" is minimal: you need to make screen room for another number and add sensor poll/screen refresh to your main loop. Once you start getting into ATR calculations factoring in the deco schedule, settable NDL-or-ATR alarms, and so on, you're looking into significant and potentially disruptive software changes. To the extent that it may be more economical to develop completely different new firmware with those functions designed in from the start.

 

[Candiru]

They started taking preorders for perdix air. Integrated at dive right in scuba

 

[kelemvor]

This thread was started because another thread (http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/co...zers/519628-shearwater-coming-out-new-dc.html) diverged into many different topics, and splitting it out into all of them was too big a job.

In that thread, one diverging discussion was related to whether Shearwater should make a computer that included air integration. If you have any opinions on that issue, please make them here. If you want to see the previous discussion to see what others said before, just follow the link above.

The question has now been officially answered by Shearwater.

Perdix AI - Shearwater Research

 

[lowviz]

Ha! So now all their tech support base runs away waving their arms and screaming.

Been done before: Judas! Bob Dylan's infamous Manchester gig to be saluted on 50th anniversary | Mancunian Matters Ooooh. Wait. That turned out to be a good thing...

They'll all come sneaking back when they figure out that it is actually rather good that your DC knows when you are going to drown. You can calculate stuff with that info.

Bruce and Lynne must be busting a gut...

 

[Reku]

Shearwater is awesome and I'm sure this product will do just as good as their other products.

I like their disclaimer - because they understand that AI isn't 100% reliable.

"NOTE: Shearwater Research recommends that you always use a backup analog SPG as a redundant high pressure reading."

I'm curious to see how reliable the transmitters are.

 

[stuartv]

I'm curious to see how reliable the transmitters are.

They're using the same transmitters that have been in use on Oceanic, Hollis, and Sherwood computers for years. They are solid.

 

[Alastor]

I'm not against AI - at all. I do not owe a SW DC, but I like their products as much I like other DC from different manufacturers.
As a telecommunication engineer I can say you that there are 2 kind of self recovering failures that normally affects AI transmitters.
1) inadvertently change the channel playing with pressures (e.g for SUUNTO and probably Uwatec, and can be easily resolved coupling the trasmitter again)
2) being temporarily jammed by an electromagnetic noise source (non-shielded electrical motor - DPV - and/or some other sources - even not-shielded spark plugs). This would often result into a loss of transmission, until the signal/noise ratio go over a required threshold - for some brands it requires to put the receiver very close to the transmitter, because they lower the sensitivity in order to be more resilient to unwanted noise.

Transmitter tecnology is the same for what concerns the transmission frequency - because this is imposed from the environment.

The high pressure sensor can also fail, but this is usually a non-recoverable malfunction: once the pressure sensor fails, it will fail forever. so the problem is the same for an analogic SPG (I saw a couple of them start failing because salt cristals or oxidation on the axle rotating the hand).

I experienced personally (during the last 3 years) 2 dives with a temporary loss of signal from the transmitter and also 2 broken SPG, the first one did not zeroed, stopping at 50 bar, while the second required a gentle bang on the hand to have a reliable reading. The second one was mine and I opened and fixed it just removing salt crystals - the sealing was inappropriate and some water spilt in during the diving week.

Comparing the two kind of failures, I consider the SPG ones more dangerous, because they could signal you more gas than actually is inside the tanks - and this is how I discovered that something was wrong: I didn't expected thos values according my experience and calculation.

Just my 2 c.

 

[dmaziuk]

1) inadvertently change the channel playing with pressures (e.g for SUUNTO and probably Uwatec, and can be easily resolved coupling the trasmitter again)
2) being temporarily jammed by an electromagnetic noise source (non-shielded electrical motor - DPV - and/or some other sources - even not-shielded spark plugs). This would often result into a loss of transmission, until the signal/noise ratio go over a required threshold - for some brands it requires to put the receiver very close to the transmitter, because they lower the sensitivity in order to be more resilient to unwanted noise.

Transmitter tecnology is the same for what concerns the transmission frequency - because this is imposed from the environment.

3) transmitter/receiver get too far apart. In the case of liquivision's ultrasonic comms that's quite a distance, but for the regular rf that everyone else's using, the distance is only about 1.5m and the coverage area is non-uniform (AFAIK, ICBW, yadda yadda). Recovery is the same as for #2, though: just move your perdix closer to the xmitter and wait.