Skip SDI Advanced Adventure (AOW) and go straight to specialties

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What everyone also needs to consider is the instructor teaching the courses. A common misconception is that Advanced Adventure is just a taste of advanced dives. It can be, yes.
But to say it is with every instructor is false. When it is offered by an instructor that recognizes what the card actually is and does it can take on a whole new meaning and be much more than a taste or tour.

I don't think that's the point. It certainly wasn't for me, when I went though it all.

The point is that, as good as your course may be, wouldn't it be even better to take the full specialty courses from you? And if so, why not just go straight to that?
 
Because some people may not want, be able to afford, or have the time for all the courses. That should not mean they don't get the knowledge, skills, and information they need.
They may also think they want to do some of the full courses but when they actually get into them find out that they really don't have an interest in them. They then have just shelled out several hundred dollars for something that is not their cup of tea.
For example, wrecks really interest many people at first. My SDI wreck class this year will be 425.00 plus fees for the boat, quarry, gas, etc. 4 dives. 6 if it's the limited penetration and an extra 125.00 for that. Dive 3 they decide that it's not as interesting or exciting. At that point the drop in interest lowers their excitement level and ability to absorb the lessons from then on. We have wasted their time and money and they may lose interest enough that I don't feel they have earned the card. Just because they paid for a class does not mean they are getting a card.
Isn't it better to get a sample of the course with the classroom time covering risks, hazards, research, and procedures for diving them in conjunction with other skills such as UW Nav, Deep, Rescue Skills, Buoyancy, Buddy, and other skills that they can use on any dive? All for the same price. They would at least have a foundation upon which to decide what classes they really want to do.
If, on the other hand, they are 100% certain of the direction they want to go, sure, I'll offer them the class. After I have made sure that they have the other skills I feel they need. Those rescue, gas management, emergency deco procedures, and use of backup air supplies. I'm not giving anyone a wreck card without deep experience. I'm not giving anyone a deep card without basic rescue skills like non-responsive diver from depth, panicked diver, supporting a diver at the surface, and rescue tows (all SEI OW skills). I'm also going to see that they know how to deploy a back up mask, buddy breathe, and lead a diver who has lost their mask. I can do that either in the Advanced Adventure Class or through a series of non cert workshops that may actually cost them more.
Then there are those who want access to advanced dives but don't have the money to spend on all the specialties.
Deep - 425.00 plus
Wreck - 425.00 plus
UW Nav - 225.00
Night/Low Vis - 165.00
Buddy Skills and Assist workshop - 175.00
Advanced Skills workshop - 200.00
Rescue Diver - 195.00
Total = 1810.00 each for a minimum of 2 divers in the class. Private class is another 30% on top of that.
Or for 425 they get the basics of each at a level that I would allow one of my kids to dive with them after the class on any of those dives at the recreational level. And they would be looking at 2 seasons to get all those in at a minimum to allow for experience dives between classes. That gives the classes time to sink in.
The people that don't have or want to take the time to get all of them in. My GF has one week of vacation a year. Her weekends are precious and diving is not the only interest. Should they be denied the access to the dives they want to do if they can get the training to do them safely without a huge time investment? I don't think so.
I'm developing other interests as I get older. Photography and flat water kayaking. I don't want to be in the water every weekend. Near or on it sure. But not every weekend for that even. Some days you just need to walk in the woods, watch tv, or just chill.
 
Most of my dives will be in the Gulf of Mexico, with occasional travel to mostly tropical locations. I am a typical vacation/warm water diver, and I don't think I will ever get into serious tech/wreck diving. Spearfishing around oil rigs and diving to deepish wrecks (non-penetration) is probably the most serious diving I would do.

It's amazing how convoluted this has become.

For warm water recreational diving it's not convoluted at all. It just seems to get that way on SB. You'll want AOW (or equivalent) and basic nitrox (up to 40%). That will get you on the more advanced rec dive sites (when YOU decide you're ready). Nitrox will get you on the day long, multi-tank trips and is good for 4/5 dive per day liveaboards. Both will get you what you want with the least amount of hassle with dive shops while traveling. Whether it's due to liability issues or dive shop/boat safety or whatever (it's endlessly debated on SB), those seem to be the prevailing rules if and/or when it even comes up depending on the dive op.

The rest is up to you. If you want Master Diver, great. Training in general is good. IMHO training does not equal experience. You need a balance. If you're into the specialties or want to "perfect" your form, there is a path for that. If you just want to dive safely and enjoy the company of like minded folks, there is a path for that. Set your goals and enjoy the journey.
 
Some resorts just want to see the AOW next to your name on the sign sheet, else they keep you above 65'swf.
That's the only reason I went for the AOW card despite getting my OW in the 80s.
 
I think your example isn't a fair comparison. The quality of your scuba instruction and how you run classes is an extremely small minority among instructors. While I agree with your points on the way YOU (NWGratefulDiver, Net Doc, etc) run those 5 dives and teach class that isn't anywhere near what they can expect from an average dive shop. We are also touching on differences in agencies and philosophies. PADI and NAUI run an advanced courses that are a set number of dives all in one shot (5 for PADI, 6 for NAUI) where different skills are touched on in each dive and there is supposed to be some over lap and a foundation is built. This class gets you a PADI or NAUI advanced open water (AOW) card that would be acceptable to any boat that states "advanced open water divers only" and can be earned by dive #10. SSI and SDI run system that requires completing individual dive specialties and having at least 25 logged dives. Each dive specialty is (2-3 dives, typically 2). In order to have a SSI or SDI AOW card a diver must complete those 4 specialties AND have 25 dives. Both SSI and SDI offer an adventure diver card that is essentially the same set up as NAUI/PADI in terms of 5 or 6 dives in a group touching on each topic, but it isn't an equivalent card based on the agency that issued it. The SSI/SDI adventure card, even though it is the same format as a PADI/NAUI AOW card, would not satisfy a boats requirement that a diver have an AOW card.

I am not disagreeing with your class structure and it has some excellent merits, especially when taught by someone of your caliber, but that 5 dive structure would not fulfill this OP desires of an SDI AOW card, hence Adventure Card from SDI is a waste and generally skipped over.
 
I'm developing other interests as I get older. Photography and flat water kayaking. I don't want to be in the water every weekend. Near or on it sure. But not every weekend for that even. Some days you just need to walk in the woods, watch tv, or just chill.

As I get older, I want the opportunity to go diving more and more since the windows for opportunity to be able to dive with age gets smaller and smaller. In fact, I don't care for anything else at all, I just want to go diving or, if weather conditions are not right, be around water even just fishing :)
 
I'm unclear why this discussion is so involved with SDI. You can basically do the same thing with PADI: do five full diving specialties (including Deep and Nav) and you get AOW automatically (although you or the shop will need to pay for the card). then you are ready for Rescue, and after 50 logged dives you can apply for the Master Scuba Diver card, if you want. The reason many folks do AOW instead of the full specialites is (a) they are not interested in the full specialties, or (b) they don't know which ones they might like. AOW is then a sampler. If you do your full specialties with the same shop or instructor, or even if you just have the AOW dives in your log book, you may be able to get credit for that first dive of each specialty toward the full specialty, thus saving some money and time, if that is one of your goals.
 
CptTP, this link doesn't seem to jive with your post #25. Can you clarify? To me it reads that the SDI Advanced Adventure Diver course is structured in much the same way and is a direct equivalent to PADI AOW.
SDI Advanced Adventure Diver | SDI | TDI | ERDI

There is an SDI Advanced Diver track that includes 4 complete specialties but it is not listed in the "Recreational Sport Diver Equivalences."
SDI Advanced Diver Development Program | SDI | TDI | ERDI
Scuba Diver Course Comparison of SDI, PADI and SSI | SDI | TDI | ERDI
 
The SSI/SDI adventure card, even though it is the same format as a PADI/NAUI AOW card, would not satisfy a boats requirement that a diver have an AOW card.

Why not? I have understood SDI Advanced Adventure Diver to be a direct equivalent to PADI AOW.
 
CptTP, this link doesn't seem to jive with your post #25. Can you clarify? To me it reads that the SDI Advanced Adventure Diver course is structured in much the same way and is a direct equivalent to PADI AOW.
SDI Advanced Adventure Diver | SDI | TDI | ERDI

There is an SDI Advanced Diver track that includes 4 complete specialties but it is not listed in the "Recreational Sport Diver Equivalences."
SDI Advanced Diver Development Program | SDI | TDI | ERDI
Scuba Diver Course Comparison of SDI, PADI and SSI | SDI | TDI | ERDI

Yes, that is the point of the post. The SDI Advanced Adventure Diver card is designed to mirror PADI's AOW, but it is not the SDI AOW card. You would not do Advanced Adventure Diver and then say I have SDI AOW. If you want an AOW in 5 dives typically conducted over a weekend go to a PADI/NAUI instructor. SDI and SSI AOW is the 4 complete specialties and 25 logged dives. Slightly different philosophies and standards, you'll find some students like the 25 dive threshold and the repetitive dives per skill set so they stick with SDI, others just want to card fast so, not taking into account Jim's class/standards, they do the PADI/NAUI method. In many ways this is semantics, legally all boats put "must have AOW", but I don't think I have ever seen it actually enforced, especially at vacation dive destinations.
 
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