Steel tank Wetsuit question

[Genesis]

disavowed by GUE, they have taken him up as their spokesman and poster child.

Its not right to "cherry pick", just like its not right to ignore Kane getting out of the water in that photo and dismissing the obvious violations of the very philosophy that he wants to force upon others.

The totality of what is being done and shown IS. Its not subject to debate or discussion. It just is. That's fine, of course, but one cannot take the positions that have been taken by GUE, then flatly ignore them when one is an instructor and expect to have people just overlook it!

Remember, DIR's claim to fame, and GUE's is that DIR is not just a gear configuration. Its a holistic system for diving, and admits no deviations from that system, encompassing not only hardware but also the physical and mental condition of the diver.

In this case, the emperor has been very clearly shown to have no clothes.

The claim of a "holistic system" such as this rests and, ultimately falls, very specifically on situations like this.

 

[bwerb]

Scott, MHK, O-ring...I think you all nailed it on the head.

Thank-you. Online bulletin boards are like little communities with their own "ground rules", "flavors" and "personalities". It serves no one any good to jump in and start attacking and name calling.

Thanks Scott for directing us to the other personalities at the forefront of GUE and DIR.

Thanks MHK for clearly expressing the sentiments of this community to those who are currently on a different page and who will most likely listen to you but ignore the other 10,000+ who also post here.

Thanks O-ring for the entertainment and the more forceful expression of what many of us think.

Brian

 

[MHK]

Genesis once bubbled...
Its not right to "cherry pick", just like its not right to ignore Kane getting out of the water in that photo and dismissing the obvious violations of the very philosophy that he wants to force upon others.

The totality of what is being done and shown IS. Its not subject to debate or discussion. It just is. That's fine, of course, but one cannot take the positions that have been taken by GUE, then flatly ignore them when one is an instructor and expect to have people just overlook it!

Remember, DIR's claim to fame, and GUE's is that DIR is not just a gear configuration. Its a holistic system for diving, and admits no deviations from that system, encompassing not only hardware but also the physical and mental condition of the diver.


The claim of a "holistic system" such as this rests and, ultimately falls, very specifically on situations like this.

I've tried very hard to ignore the majority of your posts over the last few weeks because it's clear to me that you have no desire to exchange ideas, you just want to rant and hear yourself speak. However, lest anyone think what you are saying is true, let me set teh record straight:

1) I "force" nothing on anyone. I believe passionately in a system and I therefore recommend it. I am incapable of "forcing" anyone to do anything. Diver's, or people in general for that matter, make their own choice. So ignoring your usual hyperbole, the issue is one of allowing diver's to make educated choices. Point to one example where I "forced" anyone to do anything..

2) As to your continued preaching about me violating a standard, again you look at only the part of the picture that allows you to pontificate. That picture was taken years ago, as I was gaining an understanding about the DIR philosophy. At the time the photo was taken I was neither a GUE instructor nor a member of the WKPP. Like many, I resisted DIR and it wasn't until I took it upon myself to meet and dive with George Irvine did I realize that all of the nonsense that takes place on certain lists, was just that cyber nonsense. I flew to Florida, I met George Irvine, Bill Mee, Dan Volker & Steven Grasso. We spent a day diving and discussing my diving and comparing and contrasting with DIR. Subsequent to that day George invited me to show up at Wakulla and see the operation. That was the day that picture was taken.. At that point I wouldn't say that I was DIR, I would say that I was in the process of fully understanding the totality of the system.. I certainly wasn't a GUE instructor at the time, but I recognize that guys such as yourself need to build your self-esteem by taking an out dated photo out of contaxt to help you feel better about yourself..

The difference between you and I is that I knew I made a mistake, I tried to learn what I could from it and I moved on. This photo was picked apart years ago on the tech list when it first was posted. I know you are a johnny come lately, but can you try to be more current if you expect anyone to believe that you've been a player for a while..

Short of that, save your breath and response because you I have no desire to engage you any further, you have nothing to offer so it's a waste of my time..

Later

 

[MikeFerrara]

DIR Tec Diver once bubbled...

We are here to help clean house from people like you so those people that are here to learn have a chance to, and if it is going to be a battle with you all the time, bring it on.

Would you mind telling us who commissioned you to clean house here?

As for the battle, I'll go with ya.

 

[boomx5]

MikeFerrara once bubbled...


Would you mind telling us who commissioned you to clean house here?

As for the battle, I'll go with ya.

Here's a little fodder for ya; remember this one?

He Dives An Inspiration

 

[O-ring]

They forgot to crosspost those tidbits...only the good stuff was eligible for crossposting. The funny thing is, this makes 99% of us more DIR than they are anyway...I wonder what your other buddies would think about solo ice diving and recommending Inspirations?

Care to ask them?

http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=263125&highlight=ice+solo#post263125

Ice in Finland
This weekend, I was solo diving in Finland, under ice, with my scooters (Gavin of course) and well below 40 meters and over 100 meters from my entry/exit point.

Yes, to me it is recreational diving because I do it for fun and relaxation, but completely technical in nature, as I needed to do decompression, and all of my gear is well beyond the standard recreational configuration. Everything redundant, everything streamlined and in proper order.

Would I recommend this to a non-experienced and competent diver? NEVER. I would not recommend this to almost anyone, but I know this site like the back of my hand, I am a competent diver, and it is what I wanted to do. Having the scooters also ensures that in the unlikely event something did happen, my travel time to my exit point was extremely short.

In effect, my diving was safer than most dives that people can do in almost any type of dive, but certainly well beyond the competencies of your average diver.

I will let you decide if it is tec or rec, but to me anything in an overhead environment is technical even if you are doing it for fun.

PS Please stow your comments about solo diving we will never see eye to eye, so lets agree to disagree..


__________________
DIR = Do It Right, Or Don't Do It At All

~and~

http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=254468&highlight=inspiration#post254468

From a Rebreather Instructor
Hello all.

I am a Dolphin Instructor, and I also dive with the Inspiration, and I am now getting the Halcyon RB80 very soon. Comparing these is like comparing a ferrari with volkswagen. The Dolphin is a great unit, and a lot of fun. Perfect for entry level re-breather training and getting experience. Yes, you will most likely want to get into CCR if you want to, but many are quite happy to stick with the Dolphin.

The Inspiration is also an excellent piece of equipment. Rated one of the safest units you can get. It has completely redundant computers on seperate power supplies, and lots of warning and danger signals, but you should not get involved with it unless you are already a very competent diver.

The Azimuth is a sexy maching, but for those who are ready to take more risk, and pay a lot more money too. It was originally designed for the Italian Navy, but did not succeed, and now is on the commercial market. Think about that. If you are not a seasoned re-breather diver, then stay away from it.

I chose to go with the Halcyon RB80 for my personal diving because lets face it - it holds all the world records, and the best divers in the world use it. There is no questioning that, it is fact. It is definitely NOT for anyone not very familiar with tec diving or re-breathers, so this is the golden crown to shoot for when you get at lease 200+ dives wit a re-breather.

If you are starting out, think smart and safe. The Dolphin is a perfect way to start out, and you can always sell it easily if you decide that you want to upgrade to the Inspiration or to a unit like the Azimuth or Halcyon


__________________
DIR = Do It Right, Or Don't Do It At All

EOF..

 

[Big-t-2538]

to O-ring on 4000 posts...

 

[Big-t-2538]

and from that same thread from our good friend DIR tech diver --

No I do not only train students in doubles, but I will not take them under an overhead environment without at least dual independent regs or a pony bottle. Since their lives are in my hands, I must ensure that they are safe. I could never forgive myself if something happened to a fellow diver and I could have prevented it by ensuring they had some sort of bailout system.

Do any of you other instructors take students into an overhead environment? You don't have to be DIR to answer....I'm just wondering how many instructors feel this is a good idea.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I have to go with MHK on this one. Certainly there are pictures of me that contradict the way I encourage people to dive but that's how I learned.

We have a good number of divers here who advocate DIR. Some are knowledgeable and helpful. They make many points and share knowledge that's useful even for those who will never buy into DIR in its entirety.

Others just come to pick the low hanging fruit. I guess they do it to show off or pump sunshine up their own skirts. I guess , depending on your point of view, maybe GI has earned a position where some are willing to tolerate his (eccentric?) behavior. Personally I got along this long without him and I'll make it the rest of the way. He has nothing I need bad enough to take any obuse for. He's a diver for cryin out loud. He didn't find the cure for cancer or something. No matter how good he is reported to be, it's still just diving.

These other guys are just funny attempts at look-alikes. They're nobody, even in diving. They have mastered the arrogant sound and I'm guessing that's about it.

Some questions though...

Is the purpose intimidation?...I don't know about any one else but it will take more than big talk about your diving to intimidate me.

Why would you expect anybody to tolerate it from you? I mean any one, any place, ever?

This punk attitude is something that should have been addressed at a young age by mother.

 

[Genesis]

Gee, isn't that one of the Mortal Sins according to DIR/GUE?

You gotta wonder if pennance is 20 hits off the argon bottle at 200 fsw.