The General Angst Over the PADI eLearning Program

[hydro12]

We're all looking at this from strictly an OW standpoint, but I'm curious if they will have the continuing education classes up for online review as well.

I'll give you a scenario. I'm currently in my DM class (have been for the past 6 months), but we meet no more than once or twice a month to do bookwork b/c of everyone's schedule conflicts. As such, by the time you meet for the next class for the next chapter or two, you've likely forgotten some things about the material; it also definitely makes keeping up with all the paperwork a pain. If we could go online, finish all the knowledge reviews/quizzes, etc., then just focus on interning for those several months (instead of bookwork), I think it'd be a huge boon. Working around your own schedule is definitely the single biggest advantage of distance education, and once the book work is done, you can always intern on your own time (the entire class doesn't need to be there) and do the projects individually.

 

[DET]

There's no way to know that the person taking the course is the one that will be named on the c-card. But then again, the shop I taught for let the students take their written exams home to do them.

In addition to the knowledge reviews and testing on-line, there is a final written quiz to be taken in the presence of an instructor.

 

[keyscapt]

I'd like to answer the question with a question, if I may.

Can you elaborate on the gnashing of teeth and wringing of hands you have seen, and maybe where you've seen it? That might permit a little more in-depth or informed response.

Thanks.

 

[S. starfish]

1) The classroom session is a great way to build raport with the students, to get a feel for their individual needs and to explain things in person. The students also have more time to get to know each other and it seems to me that a class room session done well can really make a course fun and much more worthwhile

2) I've definately had students who answered all of the kr questions, but met me with blank stares when I asked them a question. If I have to reteach something to a student I'd much rather have an entire classroom session in which to do it instead of trying to cram it down their throats as we scramble for the pool.

3) Trust and respect. Who would you give more to? The guy sending you e-mails who you hardly ever see or the guy who's been talking to you for the last hour and a half?
For some people (myself included) it doesn't really make a difference, but for others it really does.

elearning will definately work for some, but I think most who do it will just try to get through the class room stuff asap. I know that's what I do with any online assignments I have. Since pool time is expensive I don't really see the introduction of elearning expanding on that.

At the moment I'm pretty skeptical about elearning and it seems to me like it will make courses far more impersonal. But we wight as well try it out, if it really works then it works, if it doesn't then we get rid of it.

 

[PhilEllis]

There's no way to know that the person taking the course is the one that will be named on the c-card. But then again, the shop I taught for let the students take their written exams home to do them.

I agree that IF a student wants to fudge his way through this program, he could have someone else do the eLearning program for him or her. However, the committment of time required of another person to do this would be amazing, and I can't imagine who the average guy or girl would get to do this for them. For that matter, a student in a real classroom setting can learn just enough to pass the exam without REALLY learning the material. So, I guess there is NO defense against a person that is simply intent on cheating the system.

They then have another problem. Students that complete the eLearning program, including the on-line final exam, will still be required to take an 18 question "quick exam" when they come to the store for the water-skills work. I have a copy of the quick exam and trust me, without learning the information provided in the eLearning program, you could not pass the quick exam.

Also remember, nothing prevents an instructor (in fact, any good instructor would do this anyway) from having a pool-side discourse with the students to determine who actually knows the academic stuff and who doesn't.

If you are an instructor or store accepting eLearnng referrals, you are also not prohibited from adding classroom sessions to re-inforce that standard academic materials or to introduce additional material that might be unique to your particular diving region.

All in all, I think the program is sound. Most important....it is a learning method that will be extremely natural to the upcoming group of people that will represent the typical student 5 years from now.......the children of the gen-x parents. They already use the internet for everything. Why? Because that is what they prefer. After all, we may call them students, but they are customers.

Phil Ellis

 

[DarthWader]

I would like to ask a simple question of both consumers and industry professionals.....What is it that REALLY concerns you about PADI eLearning?

my main concern with this, or any other area of instruction, is the lack of human interaction. we've become so cellular, and more and more people perpetuate this by choosing technology over human interaction.
I don't see anything wrong wth the quality of the instruction, as the student must demonstrate his skills in person during the dive, and the test will determine if he has absorbed the material to PADI's satisfaction. For me, the problem is an e-course just can't deal with the intangibles. e-learning cannot replace intuition and experience.

 

[GrandpaScuba]

In addition to the knowledge reviews and testing on-line, there is a final written quiz to be taken in the presence of an instructor.

Please be a bit more specific. Is this the actual "final test" or is it just a "quiz" as you put it?

 

[jpsexton]

All in all, I think the program is sound. Most important....it is a learning method that will be extremely natural to the upcoming group of people that will represent the typical student 5 years from now.......the children of the gen-x parents. They already use the internet for everything. Why? Because that is what they prefer. After all, we may call them students, but they are customers.

Phil Ellis

I brought this up in another LDS vs Internet thread recently. I am sometimes amazed at how my kids (17 and 19) use the internet. They have a completely different thought process than I do. I think PADI is smart to tap into this.

 

[Eileentk]

I would like to ask a simple question of both consumers and industry professionals.....What is it that REALLY concerns you about PADI eLearning?

My primary concern is that PADI has set this program up so that it can only be administered by PADI dive shops. I'm an independent instructor and teach for several shops in the area on a contract basis with an emphasis on small group or individual classes. Although I only teach PADI programs, not all of my dive shops are PADI affiliated.

 

[GrandpaScuba]

I happen to be a computer programmer, so I am not e-phobic.

I agree that IF a student wants to fudge his way through this program, he could have someone else do the eLearning program for him or her. However, the committment of time required of another person to do this would be amazing, and I can't imagine who the average guy or girl would get to do this for them. For that matter, a student in a real classroom setting can learn just enough to pass the exam without REALLY learning the material. So, I guess there is NO defense against a person that is simply intent on cheating the system.

Many BF's would be willing to do all the quizzes/tests for their GF, just to get them to dive. Also, you don't need to have someone do the test for you. All you have to do is open a second window on Google and the Google for the right answers. (I've seen people do just that on other "online" tests.)

They then have another problem. Students that complete the eLearning program, including the on-line final exam, will still be required to take an 18 question "quick exam" when they come to the store for the water-skills work. I have a copy of the quick exam and trust me, without learning the information provided in the eLearning program, you could not pass the quick exam.

If this quiz is supposed to prove that they really took the course, why not just have the final exam proctored by a live instructor?

Also remember, nothing prevents an instructor (in fact, any good instructor would do this anyway) from having a pool-side discourse with the students to determine who actually knows the academic stuff and who doesn't.

You shouldn't even be near the pool until you are sure they know the academics.

If you are an instructor or store accepting eLearnng referrals, you are also not prohibited from adding classroom sessions to re-inforce that standard academic materials or to introduce additional material that might be unique to your particular diving region.

Web-potatos aren't likely to want to go to a store that makes them take classroom, when the whole idea was to do it online.

All in all, I think the program is sound. Most important....it is a learning method that will be extremely natural to the upcoming group of people that will represent the typical student 5 years from now.......the children of the gen-x parents. They already use the internet for everything. Why? Because that is what they prefer. After all, we may call them students, but they are customers.

I don't have a problem with replacing the DVD with an online experience, but I still think that the human interaction of the classroom is more valuable than the expediency of an online course. And I believe the final exam should be proctored at an LDS.

Social interaction is important in diving. We tell them that they have to dive with a buddy, but we're okay with them taking the course by sitting alone in a dark room staring at a tube?