The State of Diving

[*dave*]

Holy crap, the DM handed her a scorpionfish? That's spectacularly irresponsible on so many levels.

In addition to handing her the Scorpionfish, he also disregarded low air signals to the point that he was sharing air with an OOA diver, while trying to manage another buddy team who was about to cork because their tanks were nearly empty and they were underweight.

The DM seemed to think it was a pretty decent dive.

 

[Hank49]

I guess this thread will drift into the same discussion by the same people about how bad training is today. It's good that some want training standards to be raised. But it's not going to happen.
If we were to go to a minimum 8 -10 day course a lot of vacation divers won't do it because if time and money constraints. That will hurt the cash flow of the industry.
And once people are certified, if they really like diving, they'll learn on their own from diving more and watching good divers and how they dive.
How many people stop diving because of poor training? I don't buy that one.
You may run into some of the divers in that video in a few years hovering 6 inches above fire coral, motionless, clearing their mask and picking their nose.

 

[seaducer]

It must be nice to be an experienced diver, perfect in all respects, so as one can criticize and belittle those divers who are just coming on line or only have a few dives under their belt. It must be a really big ego boost for those who are inclined to do so. And: "C-cards are given to people with the bare minimum dive skills"? I guess so, since they are newbies who have only had two days of open water. Get a life.

I do not understand how anyone can watch that video, and say the problem is with people who would endeavor to make divers more skilled.

 

[seaducer]

In addition to handing her the Scorpionfish, he also disregarded low air signals to the point that he was sharing air with an OOA diver, while trying to manage another buddy team who was about to cork because their tanks were nearly empty and they were underweight.

The DM seemed to think it was a pretty decent dive.

Just another day in the life...

wonder what the DM would classify as a *bad day*

 

[ScubaSteve]

I guess this thread will drift into the same discussion by the same people about how bad training is today. It's good that some want training standards to be raised. But it's not going to happen.

That does not mean that it is a good thing. You obviously have your opinion as do others.

If we were to go to a minimum 8 -10 day course a lot of vacation divers won't do it because if time and money constraints. That will hurt the cash flow of the industry.

Perhaps a smaller industry with safer and more skilled divers might not be such a bad thing.

And once people are certified, if they really like diving, they'll learn on their own from diving more and watching good divers and how they dive.

This is absolutely not the case in most cases IMO. I have talked to more "Vacation divers" that absolutely love to dive once a year on vacation. "Additional classes??? Why would I do that when I can already dive on vacation?" Skills do not improve when you dive that way. If they do you are beyond the exception.

How many people stop diving because of poor training? I don't buy that one.

How many people die or are injured or injure somebody else because of poor training? Not agency specific....just a general question. I do not know the answer but I do believe if we turned out better divers from the start, the number would drop.

You may run into some of the divers in that video in a few years hovering 6 inches above fire coral, motionless, clearing their mask and picking their nose.

Possible......but I fail to see the problem with teaching people to dive better up front. It is OK if the diver needs to be 5' off the coral to pick their nose .....

 

[W8less]

I just got back from a trip to the Greek Isles and what I observed of the vacationing European divers seemed to match the OP's video.

 

[tkdgodess]

I started out as a vacation diver. I took OW with my Dad. I recognized from the get-go that my Dad looked like a Dufus underwater, where the instuctor looked smooth and effortless. There was noone else to influence my observation, and I had never been exposed to scuba before, just me, my Dad, the instructor. My Dad is still a vacation diver, and I am a cold water instructor. I do my very best (regardless of agency & training standard differences) to make all my students aware of buoyancy, trim, finning & skulling. It's simply a matter of pointing these things out to students and instantly (most) want to improve.

These threads all end up the same. Do you think that noone should be able to hike in the forest unless they've what? Taken all the courses at Outward Bound? What about learning the basics and then working on self improvement? The problem is like any other sport (where many of us strive to be the best we can) many people just dabble in it occasionally without being concerned about improving. Do any of you hike? It boggles my mind that someone is 4 hours from any rescue and they have NOTHING for self rescue. What the heck are you doing here and why are you stepping on all that delicate endangered columbian carpet moss? What do you mean you have nothing for self rescue or survival....
What about including Proper Diving Etiquette in training?

The DM should include awareness in the briefing... "many of you haven't been diving since you were here last year, welcome back, and to our new divers welcome to my ocean. I am reminding you to be aware of the environment you about to enter and to respect it by practicing proper buoyancy, be aware of where your fin tips are by finning in such a manner to not make contact with our reefs, please watch me as I do my best to set a good diver example"

Maybe a decent briefing will spark at least one vacation diver's memory as to the training they had...and if they didn't get the training you are directly pointing out what you expect, and you are setting an example.

Accept it, Scuba is not that elite. Lots of Vacation Divers. Let do our best as regular divers to teach the vacation divers to respect the sport and the environment. Instead of focusing on lack of training/agencies.

 

[joe8mofo]

As a new diver with less than 50 dives I will simply state that not everyone will work hard enough to become a proficient and skilled diver.

Becoming a good diver requires practice and the ability to dive often with someone who is a skilled diver. I am lucky in regards to the fact that I can go diving every weekend with a buddy who happens to be a skilled diver and an instructor. Many people are not afforded the opportunity to dive with a skilled diver often enough to develop good diving skills; furthermore I will go so far to say that some people simply treat diving as a novelty, a vacation-only thing.

There are definitely those out there who can be considered vacation-only divers, and some of the training programs out there cater to specifically that. That being said, most of the people who visit and post on scubaboard are serious-divers and not of the once or twice a year variety

 

[jmasin]

Here's my view -

STAY OFF THE BOTTOM AND DON'T TOUCH ANYTHING.

If you can do that, and want to swim with your hands, and chop with your feet and any other manner of technique, go for it.

Bottom line is not everyone is serious about it, and while it seems foreign to me, not everyone endeavors to improve themselves... so be it, it is true of many hobbies/activities. It isn't just (or even) a lack of instruction etc., it is the responsibility of the diver to try and improve. Some don't desire to invest the mental capital to improve, either because they can't or it is a small aspect of their life that they enjoy doing in the capacity they currently do it. That's ok with me.

Kudos to all those who want to be the best diver they can be, I'm one of those, and I try to improve always. I'm sure I have a long way to go. For those that don't, so be it, JUST DON'T MAKE THE REST OF US SUFFER by doing damage to the ecosystem.

That said, if your flapping hands hit me in the face again, I'm gonna hit you back (someone out there knows who they are ).

 

[hbhobby]

I always laugh when I read these posts that say we need more training and better training! most who posts these ( I assume) are people who think they would not need additional training. ok so we decide that as of today we need to make the rules more stringant. first who is going to determine what that level is? and second what makes them "good enough" to say I am "good enough"? now (answer honestly) if you went to the local dive place and you couldn't dive because you weren't a "good enough diver" (based on whom ever determined what they determined) would you say "ok I will pay $$$ and take the time to become a "good enough diver"" or would you be mad?:furious: ( I a sure the vacation diver would be mad if he couldn't "enjoy" his vacation dive because he wasn't "good enough")

I have never dove with any of you. I am SURE that lots of you are better at certain skills than I am, I am sure there are a few that aren't as good at certain skills as I am. but if you ran a poll I bet you would find that most people consider themselves to be that "good enough diver" even though most will agree that they have things to improve on. ( I think I am a "good enough" diver, and by far have not learned or perfected it all)
so it would eventually come down to who would decide what is "good enough" and then what would happen to the dive industry that sells $$$$$$ of goods to the divers that aren't "good enough"