Underwater structure near Okinawa

[RikRaeder]

Well, Smiley. It is equivocal. Half of the marine geologists (at least) that have investigated have gone on the record as saying that, yes, such right angles are formed in nature. I'm no geologist, so I won't argue with them. Are you saying Arataki is a person? Would this be Dr. Arataki who promotes the idea of the cuts being man made? If so, I found his arguments a bit weak. As I said, the "stairs" he (if it is him) shows have some pretty strange proportions if that's what they are. One step of one meter, one step of five centimeters, one step of two meters. Some pretty strange steps. Also, it takes quite a bit of imagination to see the doorway he posits or the "altar of the sun" in the big, unevenly formed rock he claims. Anyway, I'll dive it myself eventually but don't hold your breath waiting for me to change my mind. Yes, I've seen pictures of stonehenge, the pyramids at Giza, the Nazca lines, etc, and it was quite clear to me that these were indeed monuments. The odd collection of stone in Okinawa...well...ahem...didn't seize me the same way.
I don't think any true historians would have problems rewriting history books (especially here in Japan :sly. Of course, 10,000 years ago there weren't any Japanese here anyway, so that would open up the question of who would have built it.
As to "God" making a flood, interestingly enough all major world mythologies have a flood story which was ancient even in the time of Sumeria, so I wouldn't rule that out based on available evidence. I'll rank Yonaguni rock formation right up there with Atlantis until some more credible evidence comes my way.

 

[Geoff_H]

Yet right angles like what are seen in Yonaguni don't form in nature.

Do you think the Giants Causeway is man made too?

The same happens in nature, with right angles. I have seen much of the fotage also, but a visit to Yonaguni and seening the photo's of Arataki the original discover of the ruins, it is unequivical that these structures were manmade.

I'm afraid I need to disagree. There are many people who believe these are natural, not man made. Regardless of our personal opinions, it is simply flat out wrong to claim it is unequivocal.

Personally, also having dived them and watched all the documentaries I am confident they are not man made.

The reason that the scientific community does not want to admit that the ruins were manmade it would re-write human history by over 10,000 years.

How this should be phrased: "For the rock formations to have been man made would completely contradict every theory we have about human migration and technological civilization. These theories have been verified by tracking mutations through DNA histories, excavations throughout documented human migration paths and evidence of technological sophistication accurately dated using carbon dating."

On the discovery channel there was a show about 5 underwater cities (Alexanderia, Egypt; Herodville, Isreal; city in India , Yonaguni, and one in England. What if God did flood the world (in Noah Arc's Day) as it was told in the bible and we are just now discovering these under water ruins? 2/3rds of the world is covered by water, yet more men have walked on the moon than have been to the bottom of the ocean.

You need to factor in time travel too, not just a flood!

 

[Geoff_H]

Some very clear right angles here too, even some evidence of stepping.

 

[Geoff_H]

And more right angles, and some evidence of a stage area too...

 

[Baracuda Smile]

Geoff H,

Nice photos! The first photo is an exmple of crystal like grow, but I believe it is from lava. The second photo would be a better example of how Yonaguni could natural. Geoff H eventhough you have show photo's of right angles in nature, we both know they are extremly rare. The second photo shows a small area where this occured. The cliffs around Yonaguni don't have any similar rock formations, second the ruins of Yonaguni cover a vast area.

I want to invite all divers world wide to come to Yonaguni, Okinawa and make up your mind for yourself.

Have in your studies read about the Okinawan Roseta Stone? It is an ancient tablet that has old Okinawan forms of writing.

Morien Institute - skywatching through the ages homepage
UNDERWATER PYRAMIDS: JAPAN 2
‰«“ꌧ”ªdŽRŒS—^“ߍ‘“‡ (Japanese)
Yonaguni

Before the last Ice age it was possible that Taiwan and Yonaguni could have been attached to the Chinese mainland.

Western Anthotpoligy knows very little about ancient eastern culture. Remember when you took histroy in school? You learned about ancient civilizations but how often did they cover the Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, Thai's, Cambodian's, Philipino's, Indonesians, Polynesians?

Where and when did the sculptures on Easter Island come from? How did the giant blocks on Great Pyramid get to the top? Who build Stone Henge how did the stones get there? Who built the great cities in Peru above 10,000 feet? Who built the Indian mounds in the eastern USA? These are all questions that the scientific community have yet to answer so I am comfortable with the question on whether Yonaguni is real or manmade.

 

[mikerault]

In one video I saw on a TV special there was a large carving on the face of one of the monuments of someone in a headdress, it was clearly visible. How was that naturally made?

 

[RikRaeder]

Nice pictures of right angles there, Geoff. There you go, Baracuda...quivocation.
By the way Mike, Barracuda. Which branch of science do you two practice? Geology? Marine Archaeology? Just wondering. Now I'd have thought the photos Geoff posted were man-made, or at least wondered about it BUT I'M NOT AN EXPERT.

In one video I saw on a TV special there was a large carving on the face of one of the monuments of someone in a headdress, it was clearly visible. How was that naturally made?

This must be some new evidence I've never heard of. Do you remember what show it was on? I'd like to check it out. I'd think that Dr. Araki would have highlighted this. The latest I've read on it was a sensational story in the Times of India or somesuch that just rehashed the same old claims. I do remember hearing of some odd scratchings on some of the stones, but nothing close to a discernable picture. Remember a guy named Van Danaken? (sp) He found some compelling evidence for some far out stuff too! Anyway, I'll go and dive it but not being an expert, I'll have to see something pretty blatant to change MY mind. As I said, scientific opinion is pretty evenly split, so I'll respect your beliefs in this. I'd ask you to respect others' also, so please be careful with such grandiose claims as "unequivocal" etc.

 

[Baracuda Smile]

This must be some new evidence I've never heard of.

This is a face carved into the rock underwater that looks much like the faces on Easter Island.

Do you remember what show it was on? Gary Hagland and his wife "C" of the Torii dive locker were some of the first American's to dive the ruins, and it was featured on the History Channel Search Results

here on I'd like to check it out. I'd think that Dr. Araki would have highlighted this.

Arataki found the carving of the turtle and the face after the original show aired.

The latest I've read on it was a sensational story in the Times of India or somesuch that just rehashed the same old claims. I do remember hearing of some odd scratchings on some of the stones, but nothing close to a discernable picture. Remember a guy named Van Danaken? (sp) He found some compelling evidence for some far out stuff too! Anyway, I'll go and dive it but not being an expert, I'll have to see something pretty blatant to change MY mind. As I said, scientific opinion is pretty evenly split, so I'll respect your beliefs in this. I'd ask you to respect others' also, so please be careful with such grandiose claims as "unequivocal" etc. I am very open minded, and I would not use unequivocal if I was not positive of what I have read and the photo's I have seen. I think there is much more evidence for Yonaguni being manmade than there is for UFO's, abductions, Bigfoot, Lockness Monster as anyone can dive the ruins just like any one can check out the Shyinx; at any time currents and sea sea conditions provided

RikRaeder,

My hope is to attrack divers world wide to Okinawa for world class diving. Why?, I truely believe that Okinawa has as much to offer as dive site as any else where in the world. Second, I truely beleive that Okinawa has been slighted by Scuba Diving Magazines, as all they write articles on are the Carrabian, Mexico, and Hawaii. Third Okinawa is Japanese poorest prefecture with the Okinawan fishermans assosication making all the rules effecting conservation. I truely believe that scuba divers are the biggest conservationist of the worlds oceans. By bringing in divers from accross the world it will help offset the Okinawan's fishermans power and add conservation for Okinawan waters.

Yonaguni is contrivesial, I believe that they are manmade. If by spuring contriversy I get divers to dive the monument and local dive shops make money and the oceans are saved then we all win, whether the ruins are manmade or natural. Between the Hammer Head Sharks and the ruins it is still awsome diving.

There are many sites around the world that are manmade that have many questions/mysterys that I have mentioned previously and, to just throw the evidence of Yonaguni to side, as being incuded with other mysterious manmade ancient structures is ludicras.

I have dove Yonaguni, and I have spent several days driving around the island. In an age when new discoveries and new species of animals and fish are being made monthly if not weekly, I do not think it unreasonable for ancient civilizations to have existed nor for them to have built great cities that are now underwater. Even the Bible mentions a great flood that destroyed mankind all but Noah and his family. Could this not be the polar ice caps melting and the oceans risinging suddenly? With global warming now a big issue would it not be prudent to research historical ocean levels?

I find this comparison on Ancient Archaeology with Yonaguni and Peru interesting. Some have specualted that the peoples of the America's might have sailed to America instead as what we were taught in school coming accross the Alaskan land bridge.

Ancient Archaeology - List of remarkable archaeological finds

What do you guys think?

 

[Geoff_H]

Western Anthotpoligy knows very little about ancient eastern culture. Remember when you took histroy in school? You learned about ancient civilizations but how often did they cover the Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, Thai's, Cambodian's, Philipino's, Indonesians, Polynesians?

What any of us learned in school has long been superceded by modern science. Take a look at the myriad of information on the web about DNA tracking - finding rare mutations that pass down the generations and serve as markers, which can be used to show lineage and find out how people spread across the globe.

When you combine this with the evidence from excavations (and corroborate with carbon dating) I believe we have very strong evidence that humans did not have the technological sophistication to build a structure like Yonaguni when it was above water.

Where and when did the sculptures on Easter Island come from? How did the giant blocks on Great Pyramid get to the top? Who build Stone Henge how did the stones get there? Who built the great cities in Peru above 10,000 feet? Who built the Indian mounds in the eastern USA? These are all questions that the scientific community have yet to answer so I am comfortable with the question on whether Yonaguni is real or manmade.

I don't think the scientific community is puzzled by any of those things? For example, the moai on Easter mined were quarried on the island, and could have been transported on roller logs. Carbon dating has helped establish the island was populated around 700AD and DNA tracking that the inhabitants were Polynesian.

Have a look at this article,

BBC - Science & Nature - Horizon - The Mystery of Easter Island

which briefly mentions some of the techniques in use today to help unravel our history as a species:

From where did they sail?

Genetic science has resolved the first great question: from where did they sail? In the 1950s, the world famous explorer, Thor Heyerdahl demonstrated that it was possible to cross the open ocean from South America to Easter Island. Plenty of other scientists felt that the seafaring Polynesian people were more likely to have made such an awesome journey. Only recently though has DNA evidence provided proof of the first Islanders' origins. Erika Hagelberg has studied the DNA of skeletons unearthed on Easter Island. They contain a genetic marker, the so-called Polynesian motif, characteristic DNA that categorically shows the link between Polynesia and Easter Island's first settlers. They came to the Island from the west not the east, a journey which marked the furthest outpost of Polynesian society. Heyerdahl's hypothesis has been disproved.

Carbon dating of artefacts on Easter Island shows the Polynesians landed around AD700. It seems they lived an isolated existence for the next thousand years on an island measuring 22x11km, roughly the size of Jersey. The society flourished with abundant sealife and farming to feed a growing population, estimated at up to 12,000 people. The people's success manifested itself in a way that has become the Island's iconic trademark: hundred of immense stone figures - moai.

 

[iflylow]

I had a great chat with Dr Kimura, the geologist who was quoted in the History Channel special a few months ago. Some of his recent findings indicate to him that the Sunabe Structures are in the neighborhood of 1500 to 2000 years old with Yonaguni being about 500 to 1000 years older. These dates come from carbon dating of stalactites found in underwater caves about 20 miles away from the structures in about 90 feet of water. if true, it would indicate significant subduction of the land mass.

By the way, there is archeological evidence of human habitation back to 18,000 years ago on Okinawa. Minatogawa

I can't state with absolute certainty that either structure is man made. I will say that after diving both places and having several detailed discussions with Dr Kimura in person, I am convinced that human hands shaped those rocks.