While on Vacation, Why don't u like other people changin your tank?

[teddyg04]

As my kids are fond of telling me, I'm "old," so will gladly accept help hauling tanks when it's available. I also gladly accept assistance hauling my ancient bod up the ladder with my gear on (bad knees). I do prefer to set up my own gear; it's part of the fun of being a diver. I like feeling competant and in control; I also have a specific way I like the tank set.

While diving in Bermuda last year, my kids and I were the object of some surprise at first. Most of the people on the boat were off one of the cruise ships or staying at a resort, so they rented everything - and we showed up with our gear bags........ They got used to us quickly, and realized that we didn't need anyone setting up our stuff. That being said, if I were in a place where local customs would brand me as rude for doing it, I suppose I could live with having to go over everything and fixing my gear to my satisfaction (I always check the basics like o-rings and tank pressure as I set up); I just wouldn't like it.

And I always tip well. Always.

 

[simmonsjr]

You know, I don't have anything against it from a safety perspective. Personally, I just feel weird having someone doing things like that for me. I guess I just feel as though I should be doing it myself and just feel like too much of a slacker when someone else tries to do it for me.

However, there was this hotel that I once stayed at in Costa Rica where the gardener hurdled the hedge to take our bags. . . I couldn't say no to that kind of dedication, but the whole way to the room I felt like I should be carrying it myself.

 

[H2Andy]

i just like to set up my own gear

i like to know i did it right every step of the way .... call me anal ... but it's my a** on the line

 

[CrateCookie]

I guess I get to be one of the ones bucking the trend...

When on vacation, its pretty nice to let the crew schlep the heavy stuff around and set up mine and my wife's equipment--after the first day or if they watch us set them up the first time. After that, I find that they usually do a bang up job of rigging and it is not that hard for them to do. When we're done soaking the rays, we do our check to make sure that everything is go and do the dive. The last vacation I was on, they took your equipment off of you at the stern and had it re-rigged at your bench slot by the time you could get there. It was nice, efficient, safe, and we'd do it again in a heartbeat.

To date, the only issue we've ever had was the crew putting someone else's EAN cylinder on my wife's rig and that was quickly solved without fuss (we would have dove the cylinder if they had an analyzer aboard). Granted, that could have been a biggie but that's the whole purpose of a pre-dive check. If she were rigging up her kit, they could have given her the same bottle but it would have gotten caught earlier. Either way, they'd have to find the right bottle for her to dive with.

Long story short, I like to not have to set up my kit when on vacation but I check it just like I check it when I set it up myself.

 

[vladimir]

We get the point.

Yes your gear is expensive

Yes your gear is unique

Yes you want to be sure you reassure yourself of your safety on the dive

But please, we don't need the "it's my toy and you die if you touch it!" sort of behaviour on dive trips. We know you're all adults and expect you to behave as adults.

The most important point I've been trying to make is that too many people become unreasonable and behave inappropriately when it comes to their equipment. Boat staff know the operation of their boats and it only takes one overly demanding and difficult diver to make things tough for everyone else.

Independence is important but do listen to instructions - you wouldn't ignore a pre-dive briefing so why be obstructive and belligerent about setup? I find the irony in this as those who are the most precious and insolent about their equipment are also the ones who know their equipment THE LEAST and end up asking for assistance from others.

Finally, this is the reason for the pre-dive safety check. Recall - it's what every OW student is taught before they hit the water.

So chill everyone. No need for the ranting.

I am one of the divers who is happy to let crew set up my gear, swap tanks, etc. But I do have a problem with an operator who has a "sit down, shut up, and do what you're told" attitude that seems to ooze from your post. When you say "independence is important," what are you referring to, exactly? Do your divers get to independently decide where they go on the conga line that follows the divemaster?

Did you use the word "insolent" properly? Because if you think wanting to set up the gear that I own on a trip that I paid you to take me on is "boldly rude or disrespectful," then you are probably used to treating your customers like children, and I would never tolerate, much less pay for, that sort of treatment.

 

[rockjock3]

I don't let anybody touch my gear because it is my life. I service my own gear, regs included, and set up everything and do all switches myself. I dive with many, but have a few select divers that make up an inner circle. Those are divers that all think the same, dive the same, and touch each others gear, but still, only if asked to by the one it belongs to. In that case, however, we trust each other to touch our gear and know they know what they are doing and aren't going to turn our air off when they meant to turn it on.

I have seen many a dm/instructors turn off somebody's air becasue they didn't know which way is on/off. This is when the people are sitting/standing on the back deck and getting ready to jump off into the water.

 

[Louie]

Did you use the word "insolent" properly? Because if you think wanting to set up the gear that I own on a trip that I paid you to take me on is "boldly rude or disrespectful," then you are probably used to treating your customers like children, and I would never tolerate, much less pay for, that sort of treatment.[/QUOTE]

And that is your choice and your right. Nobody is going to criticise you for that. I don't know why you're getting hung up.

It seems those with the "my way or the highway" and "me me me" attitudes are mainly those who are clueless about the organisation of dives or of the running of boats.

My point is:

There is more than one way to do things. Different situations call for different procedures.

Dive staff want to do their part to ensure things run smoothly and prevent people from being injured. Who's going to be the first to complain if they are let loose on a boat in heavy current to equip and then get injured?

*My apologies to the original poster if I've strayed from the original post. This will be my last for this thread (if nothing else, we can see there are strong opinions on both sides of this debate).

 

[vladimir]

And that is your choice and your right. Nobody is going to criticise you for that. I don't know why you're getting hung up.

Am I getting "hung up"? I didn't realize that. But I think most adults would exercise their choice and their right not to be treated like children, don't you?

It seems those with the "my way or the highway" and "me me me" attitudes are mainly those who are clueless about the organisation of dives or of the running of boats.

My point is:

There is more than one way to do things. Different situations call for different procedures.

Dive staff want to do their part to ensure things run smoothly and prevent people from being injured.

This correlation between people who like to set up their own gear (those are the "my way or the highway" types, right?) and being clueless about the organization of dives and the running of boats--what do you attribute that to? It seems like an odd correlation. It's hard for me to see the causation.

I believe most dive staff are well-intentioned and want things to run smoothly and safely, but I think some lose sight of their other mission: to insure the satisfaction of their customers. If you regiment a group of divers you can run a really efficient operation and still have unhappy customers. A good example of this is the dive operation at Little Cayman Beach Resort. They can get 25 divers to the site, in and out of the water in an hour and fifteen minutes, and back to the dock in time for lunch. The staff is all highly competent and friendly. You can't fault any aspect of the operation--except that you feel like you're in boot camp, not on vacation. Maybe it's the difference between a cattle boat and a 6-pack. I now try to avoid day boats that can accommodate 25 divers. Maybe that's what you have experience with?

Who's going to be the first to complain if they are let loose on a boat in heavy current to equip and then get injured?

This is another one of those correlations you're going to have to try to explain to me. From this thread I have learned that people who like to set up their own gear are bad tippers, ignorant about boat operations, and the first to complain about injuries in heavy current. (Are passengers more prone to injury in heavy current? Or did you mean heavy seas?)

 

[Puffer Fish]

This is another one of those correlations you're going to have to try to explain to me. From this thread I have learned that people who like to set up their own gear are bad tippers, ignorant about boat operations, and the first to complain about injuries in heavy current. (Are passengers more prone to injury in heavy current? Or did you mean heavy seas?)

I believe you accidentally left out not having enought money to travel anywhere "expensive"...and only being 1% of the divers, but I think you have the basic information correct.

Note: On a personel note, I believe I represent, on a good day, roughly .0000X% of the dive population. Seems no matter how hard I try, I am stuck at the same percentage.

I understand why someone would not mind their gear being setup (not me, but I understand the concept).. I also get the the other side. The part I am missing is the few "professionals" that believe there is something wrong with anyone wanting to setup their own gear. Equally amazing is that the arguement seems to be with others that are also professionals (I think it is fair to refer to instructors in that way).

I know when I worked on a boat, if another Instructor was diving (that goes for dive master and several other experience levels), it was considered common courtesy to ask them how they wanted their gear handled. The same would go for very experienced divers. Not that a newer diver is not entitled to the same consideration, but there is a point in say rough seas, where a letting a first time boat diver change their tank may not be a good idea.

Most of us would like the make the trip go easier and safer, so there have been times when I let the crew change tanks..not a lot, but it happens.

 

[simmonsjr]

I am one of the divers who is happy to let crew set up my gear, swap tanks, etc. But I do have a problem with an operator who has a "sit down, shut up, and do what you're told" attitude that seems to ooze from your post. When you say "independence is important," what are you referring to, exactly? Do your divers get to independently decide where they go on the conga line that follows the divemaster?

Did you use the word "insolent" properly? Because if you think wanting to set up the gear that I own on a trip that I paid you to take me on is "boldly rude or disrespectful," then you are probably used to treating your customers like children, and I would never tolerate, much less pay for, that sort of treatment.

What she is referring to are not the divers who graciously decline the assistance of the boat crew in setting up their gear, but rather the ones who act like whiny petulant children who throw a tantrum when the other little boys and girls want to play with their toys too.

There is a difference between someone who acts like an adult in this situation and someone whose actions leave much to be desired (for boat crew and fellow divers both) and I think that she's seen too many divers of the first persuasion which is why she brought the subject up.

I agree with you that the sit down, shut up, and do as you're told mentality makes for a less than fun dive, but I don't think that was the position being taken. It is possible to politely refuse assistance with your gear and maintain order rather then being so offended at the thought that ANYONE touch your rig that you effectively shut down operations while you "explain" why no one touches your gear but you. A simple "no thank you; I've got it" should be all that is required. However, if the crew does not respect your wishes after being informed of them then there is an issue that needs to be addressed.

Jason