What if DIR Evolved Elsewhere... (take two)

[MXGratefulDiver]

I do wonder about this whole "runaway" inflater thing. 10K+ dives and I've never had it happen, never seen it happen and never even heard of it happening ... except at the intersection of the internet and DIR divers, which I guess I can understand that given the Q/C problems that Halcyon had and how that would have a much greater effect on the DIR community.

Is this real or an artifact of something else?

It's real ... but as you say, primarily an artifact of Halcyon Q/C.

I replaced the stainless inflators on both my Halcyon wings after experiencing it.

Thanks for responding to my questions ... it's going to take me a while to digest the answers. Seems like a pretty complicated process.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[JeffG]

It's real ... but as you say, primarily an artifact of Halcyon Q/C.

or cold water environments. Something Florida doesn't see very often.

 

[Mike Edmonston]

or cold water environments. Something Florida doesn't see very often.

True,

We experienced 3 inflator freeflows on 2 different occasions while ice diving in northern Quebec. And as a side note, one of the divers was using Atomic regs, and COULD NOT stop the thing from freeflowing! I basically let him use my Salvo sr2's after my dive, while I was tending line, otherwise he would have had to scrub the dive.

 

[limeyx]

Very well said. And 100% accurate. There needs to be more education into that line of thinking in the DIR community.

This I would agree with as long as divers dont start using it as a crutch.
I have been out (for instance) here in LA with captains that refuse to put a weighted shot line onto a wreck because they have clients that can't manage to descend the line in our relatively mild currents (for whatever reason -- maybe related to not being able to descend in good trim and kick into the current, maybe not)

These clients get to the bottom of the shot line and complain that the wreck is "nowhere in sight" and blame the captain. What has happened of course, is that through poor technique, the divers have gone (un-necessarily in most cases) hand over hand down the line and pulled it off the wreck.

However, I do think it needs to be stressed right from DIR-F in a better way.

 

[Thalassamania]

It's real ... but as you say, primarily an artifact of Halcyon Q/C.

I replaced the stainless inflators on both my Halcyon wings after experiencing it.

Thanks for responding to my questions ... it's going to take me a while to digest the answers. Seems like a pretty complicated process.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Seems complicated, but not really. Senior people go over everything that's done in a programmatic fashion. Not that hard to build up step by step, but a nightmare to try and build instantly. I've seen BSAC clubs, in the old days, that worked much the same way.

2 divers that I dive with have had it happen to them. One of them is Pete Gelbman and his writeup on the hit he took is widely avilable online, including GI3s comments in gavinscooters. Another diver had a runaway on a big dive and got it under control. I know in the latter case it had nothing to do with a halcyon inflator, and I don't know about Pete's case, but IIRC that had more to do with detuned apeks regulators not acting as an OPV before the LP inflator went...

Thanks for the Soap Opera ... it did amuse.

It does seem to be a problem limited to detuned regulators with leaky first stage seats. Given the obviously very real danger of this sort of accident (I just played with crimping the hose, disconnecting and shutting down in our pool here on Marco Island) and the know danger of freeflow (e.g., Dudas' horrible accident) one could easily start to feel like a Christian Scientist with appendicitis. Personally these issues don't worry me too much, I use rather rock solid diaphragm first stages and I do not use adjustable seconds, what's the "common wisdom?"

 

[Steve R]

............ what's the "common wisdom?"

10,000 benign temperature dives tend not produce cold water problems very much.

OTOH a mere few thousand between lamonte, Jeff, Mike(when in Quebec) (count me in too) and others will yield numerous because we dive in a different environment than you boys in general.

Quite common around here, even outside of "H" wings

 

[Thalassamania]

10,000 benign temperature dives tend not produce cold water problems very much.

OTOH a mere few thousand between lamonte, Jeff, Mike(when in Quebec) (count me in too) and others will yield numerous because we dive in a different environment than you boys in general.

Quite common around here, even outside of "H" wings

Yes, but I've made, quite literally, thousands of dives [SIZE=-1]within 23.5 degrees of latitude of both poles [/SIZE]and never experienced, witnessed or heard of the problem. Freeflow sure ... very rare, usually traceable to wrong gear or crappy technique, ... but runaway BC or suit? Never.

 

[Steve R]

Yah I figured it was just our Shiite technique

Besides, even Nunavut is warm in the summer That's when I'd dive it anyway.

Less chance of my bad technique making an influence

 

[Thalassamania]

Yah I figured it was just our Shiite technique

Besides, even Nunavut is warm in the summer That's when I'd dive it anyway.

Less chance of my bad technique making an influence

I was not attempting to criticize your practices, just looking for commonality in why y'all experience the problem, because ... quite frankly ... I'm completely unprepared for it.

 

[lamont]

Thanks for the Soap Opera ... it did amuse.

i knew we'd wind up here, which is why i locked the other thread.

It does seem to be a problem limited to detuned regulators with leaky first stage seats. Given the obviously very real danger of this sort of accident (I just played with crimping the hose, disconnecting and shutting down in our pool here on Marco Island) and the know danger of freeflow (e.g., Dudas' horrible accident) one could easily start to feel like a Christian Scientist with appendicitis. Personally these issues don't worry me too much, I use rather rock solid diaphragm first stages and I do not use adjustable seconds, what's the "common wisdom?"

i prefer not to trust the equipment and to work around possible failure modes with in-water procedures. the alternative approach leads to a lot of diving accidents where the deceased gets blamed for improper equipment care.