Dive Buddy Violence?

[Dirty-Dog]

I'm with Max on this one.

While I am a huge believer in personal responsibility, we also, by accepting the role of dive buddy, accept a certain level of resposibility for our buddy. That's what being a buddy IS.

You had tons of air, so why didn't you think going back to the anchor was a good idea? Even if you ended up sharing air, your surface swim, in difficult conditions, would have been shorter.

Why did you leave your buddy during your ascent?

You mention that you were diving nitrox. Was your buddy diving nitrox or air? Did you discuss your dive plan, including gas planning, prior to the dive?

Who was left on the boat, in case of a problem?

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Now you know why I prefer to dive solo, its so much simpler.

When I do buddy dive though, its never a deep dive until I know them and know how they dive. Bad stuff happens, divers over sell their skill and experience to prospective buddies. At 40-50' you have so many options and so much more time to recognize the issues and address them before anyone gets hurt.

 

[lowviz]

....//......I recently dove with an experienced diver off my Achilles boat ....//......

Along with Dirty-Dog, I'm assuming that there was always at least one licensed captain topside...

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Along with Dirty-Dog, I'm assuming that there was always at least one licensed captain topside...

Licensed captain?

In someone's personal RIB?



... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[TSandM]

It sounds as though the problems with this dive started on the boat, as problems often do.

Did you compare breathing gases, and discuss the implications for no-deco time?

Did you talk about a gas management strategy, whatever it would be, and agree on it ahead of time?

If the answer to those questions is no, then the dive wasn't really planned very well, and although your buddy's management of the dive would have annoyed ME, I would have been even more annoyed with myself, because these things weren't clarified at the start.

I actually had a recent dive like this. A couple of folks who I expected would be on the same page (because of their training and history) dove with me and a buddy, and we all accrued a little bit of deco obligation (not unusual for this dive) -- but at 50 feet, one of the other divers only had 400 psi left, and I had to put them on my long hose so we could do a safe, slow ascent and spend some time in the shallows. I was not amused, but it was really my fault. These two were a separate team (both of whom ended up needing gas) so, in the abstract, my buddy and I weren't "responsible" for them (and they were going to solve their own problem with a direct ascent and shallow deco) but the bottom line was that we didn't have an agreed-upon plan, so we had a problem.

In your case, if this was the first dive with this guy, I think the choice to do a 100 foot dive with someone whose habits were unknown to you may have been questionable, as well. A 100 foot dive on an Al80, if you are going to maintain safe gas reserves, will be a short dive (although if this was Great Pinnacle, I would imagine you were heavily multi-leveling it).

So I think there's plenty of error on both sides, and if you are going to punch your buddy in the nose, he gets to punch you back

 

[ScubaSteve1962]

It sounds as though the problems with this dive started on the boat, as problems often do.

Did you compare breathing gases, and discuss the implications for no-deco time?

Did you talk about a gas management strategy, whatever it would be, and agree on it ahead of time?

If the answer to those questions is no, then the dive wasn't really planned very well, and although your buddy's management of the dive would have annoyed ME, I would have been even more annoyed with myself, because these things weren't clarified at the start.

I actually had a recent dive like this. A couple of folks who I expected would be on the same page (because of their training and history) dove with me and a buddy, and we all accrued a little bit of deco obligation (not unusual for this dive) -- but at 50 feet, one of the other divers only had 400 psi left, and I had to put them on my long hose so we could do a safe, slow ascent and spend some time in the shallows. I was not amused, but it was really my fault. These two were a separate team (both of whom ended up needing gas) so, in the abstract, my buddy and I weren't "responsible" for them (and they were going to solve their own problem with a direct ascent and shallow deco) but the bottom line was that we didn't have an agreed-upon plan, so we had a problem.

In your case, if this was the first dive with this guy, I think the choice to do a 100 foot dive with someone whose habits were unknown to you may have been questionable, as well. A 100 foot dive on an Al80, if you are going to maintain safe gas reserves, will be a short dive (although if this was Great Pinnacle, I would imagine you were heavily multi-leveling it).

So I think there's plenty of error on both sides, and if you are going to punch your buddy in the nose, he gets to punch you back

Well said

 

[DivemasterDennis]

The answer to your question is no, even though it may have been deserved. He was fortunate you were there to save his butt. You are not alone. I think your would enjoy "The Scuba Snobs Guide to Diving Etiquette.'' You'll get a laugh. He would learn something. From Chapter 6:

LOOK AT YOUR GAUGES REGULARLY
Ok divers, listen up. Before we go on our next dive, let’s review some basics. Running off of your first stage (that thing connected to your tank of compressed air) there are four hoses. One is a low pressure inflater hose attached to your buoyancy vest. The second hose goes to your primary regulator so you can breathe under water. The third goes to your alternate air source (unless you have a low pressure inflater alternate air source set up) so someone else can breathe off your tank in an emergency. FINALLY, the fourth hose goes to your submersible pressure gauge, and maybe your computer, what we will call your “console.” That is what we are talking about here, the gauge console at the end of the fourth hose. ( We get it- some of you have wrist mounted integrated, no hose computers and stuff- fine. Quit interrupting).
As to the stuff at the end of the fourth hose, (or on your wrist mount) look at it now and then! Some people never look at their gauges, believe it or not. You should look at the pressure gauge before your dive and see if you have sufficient air for the dive. You can look at it during the dive and you will see how much air you have left. Isn’t that something? Look at it during the dive and it will tell you how deep you are. Look at your computer and you will actually see how much no decompression time you have left at the depth you are at! No joke! It’s amazing! So look at your console!
Why watch your gauges? For your safety and the safety of those around you. We all want to enjoy the dive, and we want you to enjoy the dive too. If your air is limited, please consider reducing your depth by ten feet or so you won’t make us all go up because you are low on air. To know where you stand on air, or how deep your are, YOU NEED TO LOOK AT YOUR CONSOLE! It’s part of good diving etiquette. It will help reduce the times other divers have to retrieve you from unsafe depths, or escort you to the dive boat as you suck the air from our tank ( which we will share willingly if needed ) because you didn’t pay attention to your air supply. Keeping an eye on your gauges will also enhance you awareness generally, which leads to better diving skills.
We shudder when we hear a diver after a dive ask “How deep did we go?” or “How long were we down?” Sometimes they will look at their computer for the first time after the dive and say “WOW, I didn’t know I went that deep!” These people are disasters waiting to happen. A distressed diver can be a hazard to those who try to assist them. Be a safe diver. Be aware. Look at your #%!**+ gauges! Read them often. Live to dive another day.

So, Bogie, we fell your pain. The book is on amazon, bn.com, its everywhere. Enjoy!.
DivemasterDennis

 

[freewillie]

In terms of diving errors you have a right to be upset with him for not checking his guages. Just goes to show that even experienced divers can make mistakes. BTW what was your predetermined turn around time? Did you and your buddy set a limit for PSI when it was time to head back to the anchor line or did you just assume since he had several dives he would know when to call the dive and head back?

He could be upset that you left him at 15 feet knowing that he was low on air. Not knowing what dive computer he had the more conservative brands may put him into deco (Suunto for example). You had plenty of air to stay down with him to ensure that nothing happened when he was doing his safety stops. What if he ran out of air? Would you have been close enough to give him your octo looking down at him from the surface?

Instead of punching him in the nose for running low and forgetting to check his air a more constructive approach would be to have asked him "Did you mean to come back on board with only 200 PSI?" At that point you could have discussed air management issues so the next time (if there is one) you dive together you both have a better understanding of planning your dive.

In any event, I'm not a fan of physical violence in any form. I may not start a fight but I sure might finish it

 

[Zieg]

no, No, NO! You don't punch him in the nose. Since he was a BAD, BAD dive buddy, you should have rolled up a newspaper and swatted him over the head.

 

[ktomlinson]

Freewilie hit the nail on the head. Talk to this guy and ask him 'do you usually dives like that, or did you just have a horrible dive?' You could also ask how often something like that happens. Then you would know if you wanted to dive with him again.