Diving off Private Boats

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DawgPaddle

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Lansdale Pennsylvania
Hi

A buddy of mine who just started scuba classes, last night in fact, owns a twenty-two footer and I was wondering if there are any legal issues about diving off of his boat. He won't be doing commercial ops or anything, just a couple of friends wanting to dive off of it.

If we have a Dive Flag, is that all we'll need to be legal for diving?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks
 
Don't know about the legal aspects. State laws can vary. You may want to focus on non-legal issues as well (anchoring, emergency including O2, etc.)
 
DawgPaddle:
Hi

A buddy of mine who just started scuba classes, last night in fact, owns a twenty-two footer and I was wondering if there are any legal issues about diving off of his boat. He won't be doing commercial ops or anything, just a couple of friends wanting to dive off of it.

If we have a Dive Flag, is that all we'll need to be legal for diving?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks

WATER


Just don't get stupid and his boat insurance should cover whatever. A quick call to the insurance company can give you the best info.

Gary D.
 
DawgPaddle:
Hi

A buddy of mine who just started scuba classes, last night in fact, owns a twenty-two footer and I was wondering if there are any legal issues about diving off of his boat. He won't be doing commercial ops or anything, just a couple of friends wanting to dive off of it.

If we have a Dive Flag, is that all we'll need to be legal for diving?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks

I presume you are asking about things that are additional to those already needed to be legal as a boat on the water that doesn't have divers on it.

And, rather than just being legal, perhaps you also want to be safe, even if something isn't required just to be legal. Many folks, for example like a boat to have oxygen on board...I'm not sure if it is "required", but it sure is nice. And, take the class, so you know what to do with it if something happens.
 
DawgPaddle:
Hi

A buddy of mine who just started scuba classes, last night in fact, owns a twenty-two footer and I was wondering if there are any legal issues about diving off of his boat. He won't be doing commercial ops or anything, just a couple of friends wanting to dive off of it.

If we have a Dive Flag, is that all we'll need to be legal for diving?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks

Yes, a flag. That's it.
 
From a legal standpoint O2 is important to have aboard as it is something that is regarded as prudent to have aboard a dive boat especially if any deep diving is involved. Having what is reasonable and prudent aboard your boat can be very important if you ever end up pitted against an angry widow and their attorney.

A first aid kit is also important as is a marine radio and a cell phone if you are going to be any substantial distance from dock as they will make it possible to call for help.

Beyond that you want all the legally required saftey equipment on board and you want to have the boat rigged with some of the ammeneties required to make diving easier.

A suitable boarding ladder is important to get divers safely out of the water as are any lines that may be approrpriate for getting divers to and from the ascent line and that may be needed to secure gear during the exit.

You also want to be sure to have appropriate tank storage whether it be tank racks or some other type of retainer for the tank. Loose tanks can cause injury and damage on the boat and this is another one of those reasonable and prudent measures.

I also suspend a saftey tank at 20 feet to ensure adequate air (actually Nitrox 50) for deco or saftey stops in the event a diver runs short. This is probably optional but is still a very good idea worth considering.

It is also a good idea to limit the passengers to no more than 6 unless your freind has a masters certificate. It keeps it cleaner, especially if anyone is providing cash to cover the boat's operating expenses. This could potentially be construed as compensation in court and could cause problems for the amatuer captain after an accident if more than 6 people were aboard.

Anchoring also presents serious considerations as you should ideally have someone who is capable of operating the boat aboard the boat during the dive to ensure the boat will still be there when you surface and who could pull the anchor and come get you if you surface down current from the boat. It's alwasy nice to for a pair of diver freinds to have another non-diving freind who just likes to be on the water and will come along to mind the boat.
 
DA Aquamaster:
I also suspend a saftey tank at 20 feet to ensure adequate air (actually Nitrox 50) for deco or saftey stops in the event a diver runs short. This is probably optional but is still a very good idea worth considering.

If the mixture in the safety tank is other than air, you might wish to consider making sure everyone who might use it is certified for the mixture and knows what it is. I can see a scenario where someone has an accident while using it or after using it (even if using the gas isn't the root cause) and someone sues you because they weren't experienced in using the mix(among other reasons).
 
DA Aquamaster:
It is also a good idea to limit the passengers to no more than 6 unless your freind has a masters certificate. It keeps it cleaner, especially if anyone is providing cash to cover the boat's operating expenses. This could potentially be construed as compensation in court and could cause problems for the amatuer captain after an accident if more than 6 people were aboard.
Nonsense.

First, federal law CLEARLY defines what constitutes "compensation"; passengers on a recreational vessel may voluntarily contribute to the direct costs of the voyage, including donations of fuel, food, beverages and other expenses. This was written into the federal code after a number of Congresscritters noted that their own vessels were being operated illegally since the former definitions prohibited ANY exchange of ANYTHING unless the master had a USCG license. What you cannot do is set a "fee" to be paid for carriage - that is a "for hire" operation. So if you and ten friends go out on your boat, they all bring food and drink which you all consume, when you get back you announce to the group how much fuel you burned, and they get out their wallets and hand you money (their discretion to do so or not), you're in the clear unless what you receive GROSSLY exceeds the cost of the fuel (and oil, if 2-stroke motor(s)) burned.

Realize that "the direct costs of the voyage" GREATLY exceed the fuel consumed on ANY boat.

Where you would be likely on the "wrong side of the line" is if you collected the funds BEFORE the voyage. It would be EASY to argue that such an arrangement was a carriage-for-hire situation (e.g. the pax had "bought a ticket".) The key is the voluntary nature of the contribution and its reasonable correspondance to the cost of operation; your enforcement has to be limited to not inviting the person on the next trip.

Second, it does not matter how many people are on board, provided you are within the vessel's capacity (if it has a capacity plate - yacht certified vessels DO NOT. Typically, vessels under 26' have a capacity plate, larger ones typically do not.) If you are over capacity then there is an issue if you get boarded or there is an incident; the USCG can get very unhappy about this. The presence of one or twenty people on board is not relavent to the classification of the vessel. If you are carrying people for hire, irrespective of the number you need a Captain's License (OUPV for up to six revenue passengers, Masters for more) AND for more than six the vessel typically must be inspected and certified for that number of pax as well. If you are NOT carrying pax for hire then you must have the legal equipment on board for each person (e.g. a lifejacket appropriate for their body size and your destination) and the vessel must have its minimum equipment (distress signals, fire extinguishers, etc) but that's it from a legal perspective.

The owner would be wise to have appropriate insurance, including possibly an excess liability policy (a "personal umbrella"), just in case, and DO NOT break the rules on "for hire" operation (since that will typically void your insurance!)

On a 22' boat carrying more than six DIVERS will be impossible with tanks and gear while remaining within the capacity plate. Not a snowball's chance in hades on that one. A diver is about one and a half "persons" for purposes of computing capacity, assuming they show up with two tanks and standard gear; remember that the capacity plate shows BOTH a person AND weight load, and you cannot safely exceed EITHER.

For ANY boat used for diving I'd want O2 on board, but that's me.

All boats need a means of reboarding. Dive boats need one that won't tear out or be damaged by a diver, in full gear, using it.
 
Genesis:
On a 22' boat carrying more than six DIVERS will be impossible with tanks and gear while remaining within the capacity plate. Not a snowball's chance in hades on that one. A diver is about one and a half "persons" for purposes of computing capacity, assuming they show up with two tanks and standard gear; remember that the capacity plate shows BOTH a person AND weight load, and you cannot safely exceed EITHER.
With the noted exception of Pontoon boats.
 

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