Do I need gauges if I use an Air Integrated Computer?

[Lucy's Diver]

And your source for that statement is?

Don't you think it would rely on the circumstances of the diving?

For example, (and from real life) if I've paid $140 to do a two tank dive in Maui and my AI 'puter goes south on the 1st dive, I'd REALLY want to be able to say "Look, I have a back up" and be able to do the 2nd dive (or 3rd if it happens to be a three tanker!). Having a simple bottom timer and an SPG wouldn't cost THAT much and would save a LOT of money on many a vacation. (My backup BT is a Suunto Mosquito which is, of course, a full fledged 'puter but w/o the pressure gauge.)

The fact that typically there might be one other guy on the boat with redundant computers besides me when I do AL80 warm water diving (i.e. the bulk of the industry). I do dive an AI computer on a hose with watch style computer as a backup, with an analog guage set in my kit if the AI fails. From what I have seen (in Maui, the Keys, Mexico, Roatan, etc. etc.) this is very rare.

It is more common when I dive locally off the Jersey coast, most people dive with redundant computers, but you're getting a more technically and skilled set of divers here for this type of diving.

If I actually had to pay for this redundancy I might not do it for AL80 vacation diving. My warm water diving gear (IA compuer and reg set) I bought, but the watch and the stuff I use locally is issued to me through work. From what I have seen on typical warm water dives in resort type places most people just don't do it.

I do it, but I dive for a living and get a lot of my gear for free from work. I agree with you, it makes sense, people should do it, but people should wear their seatbelts all the time and never drive while talking on a cell phone either.

 

[GLENFWB]

I use an AI computer and love it...don't care what the nay sayers think. It is a great tool. But, I always have a small SPG also. If I had two or three AI's I would still want the pressure gauge as a backup. I use an AI computer and my back up is a simple dive watch. The backup SPG saved one dive for me. I will check it frequently throughout the dive to make sure it agrees with the AI computer. It's all about what makes you a comfortable, SAFE diver.

Just purchased my own equipment I picked up 2 Smart Z's new and reasonably priced. Do I need gauges as a back up? Are they required by dive charters? Should I just buy a pressure gauge or get the whole setup including a compass. Pretty new to diving so be gentle!!!

 

[ShakaZulu]

Imagine you're at 100ft, doing a nice dive...you look at your computer, and the air pressure is ZERO. Your narcosis goes to a whole new level, panic sets in, how will you deal with it? Let's make it more fun, imagine you're doing a night dive. Unless you are diving rock bottom times, you will probably be low on air near the end of the dive. If you're comfortable with that feeling, then go ahead. You can do a lot to mitigate risk, or you can become a statistic.

 

[Web Monkey]

Imagine you're at 100ft, doing a nice dive...you look at your computer, and the air pressure is ZERO. Your narcosis goes to a whole new level, panic sets in, how will you deal with it? Let's make it more fun, imagine you're doing a night dive. Unless you are diving rock bottom times, you will probably be low on air near the end of the dive. If you're comfortable with that feeling, then go ahead.

I'm not sure I see a problem.

Computer says "0"

• Q: Am i still breathing?
  • Yes: Poke buddy in ribs, give LOA sign, give thumb, do a normal ascent
  • No: Poke Buddy in ribs, give OOA sign, share air, give thumb, do a norman ascent

If you're arguing against computers and for mechanical gauges, you could easily have said "What happens when the gauge says 1000PSI and you have no air".

FWIW, the above process works in either case.

Terry

 

[NudeDiver]

Imagine you're at 100ft, doing a nice dive...you look at your computer, and the air pressure is ZERO. Your narcosis goes to a whole new level, panic sets in, how will you deal with it? Let's make it more fun, imagine you're doing a night dive. Unless you are diving rock bottom times, you will probably be low on air near the end of the dive. If you're comfortable with that feeling, then go ahead. You can do a lot to mitigate risk, or you can become a statistic.

Imagine you're at 100ft, doing a nice dive...you look at your SPG, and the air pressure is ZERO. Your narcosis goes to a whole new level, panic sets in, how will you deal with it? Let's make it more fun, imagine you're doing a night dive. Unless you are diving rock bottom times, you will probably be low on air near the end of the dive. If you're comfortable with that feeling, then go ahead. You can do a lot to mitigate risk, or you can become a statistic.

 

[HowardE]

Let's go back to the original question again...

Do I need gauges if I use an AI computer?

Quantified: For standard recreational diving - NO.

I would even be so bold to say... that you could (even on a week long liveaboard) dive the whole time with no computer, no spg, and no depth gauge (if you stuck with the DM) - Am I recommending this? NO. Don't go and try it (and most likely the operation won't allow you to do this) - but could it be done? Think about it...

Here in Florida... I frequently dive a similar profile more than 50-70 times a year (at least) - 60 foot dive (hard bottom) 1 hour of bottom time (out of respect for the boat) Could I do a dive with just a tank and reg? Yes. What if? What if? I'm not talking about disastrous scenarios here, just a simple illustration. COULD it be done? Yes... That's all I'm saying... SHOULD people dive like this? Not in my opinion.

Also - If you're doing a recreational dive, at 100 FSW, and "all of a sudden notice your SPG says ZERO" and you haven't had a catastrophic gas loss... you shouldn't be diving... since obviously you haven't looked at your gauges the entire dive until this point??

----

Does a recreational diver need a set of gauges for standard recreational dives? Simple answer... No. If you're really worried... end the dive.

 

[ShakaZulu]

Imagine you're at 100ft, doing a nice dive...you look at your SPG, and the air pressure is ZERO. Your narcosis goes to a whole new level, panic sets in, how will you deal with it? Let's make it more fun, imagine you're doing a night dive. Unless you are diving rock bottom times, you will probably be low on air near the end of the dive. If you're comfortable with that feeling, then go ahead. You can do a lot to mitigate risk, or you can become a statistic.

That is true, but the probability of an SPG failure is significantly less than the number of times divers report loss of comms with their AI system. Yes, and if it happens, abort the dive.

 

[Web Monkey]

That is true, but the possibility of an SPG failure is significantly less than the number of time divers report loss of comms with their AI system. Yes, and if it happens, abort the dive.

AI isn't necessarily hose-less.

Terry

 

[NudeDiver]

That is true, but the probability of an SPG failure is significantly less than the number of times divers report loss of comms with their AI system. Yes, and if it happens, abort the dive.

Um....again...not all AI systems use "comms". Some of them use the same hose that an SPG uses.

 

[Slonda828]

That is true, but the probability of an SPG failure is significantly less than the number of times divers report loss of comms with their AI system. Yes, and if it happens, abort the dive.

Shaka,

I'm not trying to sound provoking here, but do you have any actual, real empirical evidence to back that up?

I think the point is, dive with what you feel safe with. If you know your J valve pinches your air at 400PSI, then maybe you don't need a SPG. If you know your computer is reliable, and carry a spare battery and o-ring, then maybe you don't need another gauge. If you paid a ton of money for the trip, then toss a SPG in your bag before you leave. We're not re-inventing the wheel here, the bottom line is go with what you feel safe with.

As for the OP, if you want my .02 cents. I dive air integrated (WITH a hose). I've never once had a failure, I change my battery at the recommended interval, and I have a SPG in my bag (on my spare regulator) just in case I have a reg or computer problem on the boat. I only do that because boat trips are $150 and I already have two regs and an extra SPG. Go for whatcha know.