OP
Maggie, the short answer for your question is Yes. Having said that however, we need to focus on one thing at a time. When the time comes to rock the boat... we'll rock the boat!
Giving Diving a Bad Name
- Thread starter Mario S Caner
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scubakat
Senior Member
To PADI's credit, I think that they recently changed the name of their "advanced" program to "Adventure Diver". On the other hand, there is a big flashing banner on their web site that says "100 Dives? 6 Months Diving? GO PRO!".
-kate
lildiver
Guest
I'm fairly new to these boards and I enjoy reading the posts here. I find them helpful and informative. I currently have an AOW and am in the midst of my rescue training course. I agree that Advanced Open Water is not the best label and also that a "C" card or label does not make anyone an advanced diver. Only more dives and more dives (I think they call it experience) in varied types of conditions can make us better divers. I think diver education is a very good thing. But as individual divers, we need to take the responsibility of practicng what our instructors have taught us in our classes. I waited until I had over 80 dives before enrolling for Rescue Diver and I will wait until I have over 100 dives before enrolling in the dive master course. I personally want to be sure that I can perform the skills I have learned at each education level calmly and with confidence. I feel this will make me a better diver and a much better dive buddy.
~lildiver
~lildiver
socaldiver
Contributor
I like what I have been reading about possible changes that are being suggested before being "labeled" an AOW.
Becoming a rescue diver before achieving the AOW cert is a good idea IMHO. In the PADI Adventures in Diving program there is a "Peak Performance Buoyancy" course. I believe a diver should be able to demonstrate a high level of buoyancy control before receiving a certification for AOW. In my short time of experiencing our lovely sport I have witnessed a lot of people "bouncing" around that could cause some serious complications. Also, I feel there should be further surface swimming skills demonstrated (OW requires a 200m swim, I believe that is what the length was, and to achieve DM and Instructor you need to swim a considerable distance as well I believe).
The other "fun dives", such as UW Photography, UW Naturalist, etc, etc, etc do not make you an advanced diver and IMHO therefore should not be a choice for becoming an advanced diver. Deep dives, night dives, boat dives, navigation, drift, search and recovery are dives that I think require some sort of skill that can be used to assess a diver's level of competency.
What can WE do to put these thoughts in front of the certifying agencies to possibly change their way of thinking and make the levels of certifications meaningful instead of an "ego" trip for some people.
Just my thoughts.
Becoming a rescue diver before achieving the AOW cert is a good idea IMHO. In the PADI Adventures in Diving program there is a "Peak Performance Buoyancy" course. I believe a diver should be able to demonstrate a high level of buoyancy control before receiving a certification for AOW. In my short time of experiencing our lovely sport I have witnessed a lot of people "bouncing" around that could cause some serious complications. Also, I feel there should be further surface swimming skills demonstrated (OW requires a 200m swim, I believe that is what the length was, and to achieve DM and Instructor you need to swim a considerable distance as well I believe).
The other "fun dives", such as UW Photography, UW Naturalist, etc, etc, etc do not make you an advanced diver and IMHO therefore should not be a choice for becoming an advanced diver. Deep dives, night dives, boat dives, navigation, drift, search and recovery are dives that I think require some sort of skill that can be used to assess a diver's level of competency.
What can WE do to put these thoughts in front of the certifying agencies to possibly change their way of thinking and make the levels of certifications meaningful instead of an "ego" trip for some people.
Just my thoughts.
I agree with all. That is why I state I am a new diver. I just recently talked someone just certified from taking the AOW the weekend following his OW certs. It was my humble opinion that diving within the OW limits was the best thing to do at present. Work on being comfortable in the water. Comfortable with his gear, bouyancy etc. Although I hold an advanced card I still do not exceed the OW limits. I am just now feeling comfortable with my bouyancy etc. I continue to work on navigational skills. AOW should without a doubt require a min # dives. I do not believe anyone with less than 20 should even be allowed to start the AOW with any organization. I now have 32 dives logged and just feel comfortable in fresh water. (only two salt water dives Key Largo). Anyway I love the sport wished I had started 20 years ago and not wait until I was 38. Happy diving all. Butch
Folks,
I am very happy when the DM or captain of a boat we are going on asks, "How many dives do you have and when was the last time you dived?" That information is vital, in my opinion.
I would not be happy if he/she asked, "What is your level of cert.?"
# of dives and recent experience are more telling. Also, I am more than pleased when they ask to see my air pressure gauge during a dive. That will tell them a lot, too.
The DM's major responsibility, in my opinion, is safety. She/he can only acheive that by asking and observing. So, if the DM's that you go with do not do those things, think twice about whether you really want to be in their care.
Now, I have dived with lots of shops where the DM does not accompany the divers. But I still want them to ask about # of dives and recent experience, because that will let them know how much leeway to "give" the divers. For example, on one dive we were with just cert'ed divers and, upon hearing this, the captain suggested (quite strongly) that they keep the boat and/or buoy line in sight. They were relieved to get that advice and did just fine.
Egad, I better give this soap box back to Socaldiver--I only meant to borrow it and I seem to have latched on. Sorry....
Joewr
I am very happy when the DM or captain of a boat we are going on asks, "How many dives do you have and when was the last time you dived?" That information is vital, in my opinion.
I would not be happy if he/she asked, "What is your level of cert.?"
# of dives and recent experience are more telling. Also, I am more than pleased when they ask to see my air pressure gauge during a dive. That will tell them a lot, too.
The DM's major responsibility, in my opinion, is safety. She/he can only acheive that by asking and observing. So, if the DM's that you go with do not do those things, think twice about whether you really want to be in their care.
Now, I have dived with lots of shops where the DM does not accompany the divers. But I still want them to ask about # of dives and recent experience, because that will let them know how much leeway to "give" the divers. For example, on one dive we were with just cert'ed divers and, upon hearing this, the captain suggested (quite strongly) that they keep the boat and/or buoy line in sight. They were relieved to get that advice and did just fine.
Egad, I better give this soap box back to Socaldiver--I only meant to borrow it and I seem to have latched on. Sorry....
Joewr
socaldiver
Contributor
Joewr!!
:froggy:
:froggy:
lildiver
Guest
I've traveled to the panhandle of Florida for some "ocean" diving and gone into dive shops, signed up for a boat trip, rented a couple of air tanks and not once was I asked to show my "C" card. On the boat going to the dive site, I was never asked for my "C" card nor was I ever asked how many dives I had or the date of my last dive. Could they tell I was actually certified by the way I looked?? When diving at the local quarries around my area, the operators ask to see my log book and they take my "C" card and keep it until I leave the site. I rather like showing off my "C" card *grin*
`lildiver
`lildiver
Ontario Diver
Guest
I did my AOW last weekend. ( I had 12 dives logged prior to it). I do *NOT* believe that I am an advanced diver. The course was very good and provided a range of experiences. (By the way we did 6 "adventure dives" - Nav, Bouyancy, Night, Deep, Multilevel, and DPV)
There were a number of people on the course that had just finished thier OW. I think that they had more "challenges" then those who had logged even 10 dives, especially in the bouyancy area. (after the PPB dive; everyone got better)
IMHO, the AOW course is not a "training" course. It is an oppourtunity to get a taste of some of the different types of diving available under professional observation, with minmal instruction. We were continually reminded that the training for the specialties came in the next set of courses. It was also a heck of a lot of fun!
Although I'm new (and learning; thanks all), I can't agree with doing the rescue course before the AOW. I think that the rescue is an essential course (and I'm doing it in the spring after I log about 25 dives), but I believe that the diver-trainee must be very comfortable in the UW environment. I think that the AOW course assists greatly in making the new/novice diver more comfortable.
Let me sum up....It is an Advanced Open Water course (ie. not the basic Open Water course), it is not an Advanced Diver Course.
There were a number of people on the course that had just finished thier OW. I think that they had more "challenges" then those who had logged even 10 dives, especially in the bouyancy area. (after the PPB dive; everyone got better)
IMHO, the AOW course is not a "training" course. It is an oppourtunity to get a taste of some of the different types of diving available under professional observation, with minmal instruction. We were continually reminded that the training for the specialties came in the next set of courses. It was also a heck of a lot of fun!
Although I'm new (and learning; thanks all), I can't agree with doing the rescue course before the AOW. I think that the rescue is an essential course (and I'm doing it in the spring after I log about 25 dives), but I believe that the diver-trainee must be very comfortable in the UW environment. I think that the AOW course assists greatly in making the new/novice diver more comfortable.
Let me sum up....It is an Advanced Open Water course (ie. not the basic Open Water course), it is not an Advanced Diver Course.
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