Heavy legs and bouyant head suggestions (opposite of earlier post)

[rhwestfall]

Steel tanks......

 

[Texasguy]

It looks like you have a lot of air in your wing. Why is that?

Oxytech doesn't "taco" by design, therefore, just looks that way.

 

[Michael Guerrero]

I have the same issue in single tank. First, I'd say stop putting an ankle weight on your 1st stage. It goes around the neck of your tank, not on your regulator.

Second, I put weight on my shoulders (above the D-rings) using some XS Scuba trim pockets. There are several ways to rig this including bungee and zip ties on top of sliding them on the shoulders or around them with the velcro.

Here they are"

XS Scuba Velcro Weight Pocket | Dive Right In Scuba - Plainfield, IL - Dive Right in Scuba

Same setup as far as trim pockets as Texasguy.

 

[Storker]

I have the same issue but in a drysuit....quite light fins.

I'm a bit puzzled that you have that problem in a DS. One of the many reasons I love my DS is that I can adjust trim by moving the air in my suit. Feet too heavy? Go somewhat feet-up for a little while, and presto! Floaty feet.

I have a problem with heavy feet if I'm in a WS, and it's annoying that I can't just move a little air into my legs to counteract that.

 

[DiverRtNY]

T-bone: You make some great points and I totally agree with what you are saying. Being <50 dives deep I agree that reflecting on my body positioning and trim through experience and practice is clearly the best practice to receive the desired results. Acknowledging that fins and gear, outside of the "common" weight distribution, holds variance alone as to how your buoyancy will be reflected.

Guerrero: I mistyped as to where my "high tank" weights are distributed. I do place them around the neck of the tank and not actually around the Stage (regulator) itself. My current, and only, BCD I use (Aeris Ocean's 5) doesnt truly have D-rings on the shoulder straps but more of "loops" made out of the actual BCD material.

yourself and others have recommended similar approaches to weight dispersion which seems to be a catch 22 as to safety and initial concern for wanting to alleviate the tank neck weight in the first place.

I guess the best "hogarthian" approach (for lack of better terms) would be to adjust common gear (fins, boots, tank position, bcd positioning, and "common" weight distribution) and DIVING EXPERIENCE (w/ trial and error to correct body positioning and extremity positioning) as apposed to ADDING additional setup. Compensating skills by ADDING extra setup as opposed to reflecting on the diver itself seems to be placing a band-aid over the result and not the cause (or primary issue).

Thanks again for everyone's thoughts and experience.
Dave

 

[Kharon]

... as soon as you allow your knees to start falling the rest of your body will follow.

Yeah, but that's about all you got right. Someone with a lot of upperbody fat and very muscular, lean legs will be leg heavy. Your "perfect body position" crap only works when moving. When hovering, motionless in the water you have to be trimmed right or something's going to sink and you won't hold your body position.

 

[tbone1004]

I did say vast majority, and "you can fix most seriously out of whack trim problems"

Those with a lot of upper body fat and muscular lean legs are certainly not the "norm" and there are exceptions to every rule. Even in that situation, with the right fins, and the right tank placement, they shouldn't need any more than maybe 2lb weights on each shoulder. Certainly none of the, trim weights on cam bands, trim weights on the tank neck, all of this junk sitting behind you that will make your body want to roll over naturally because you float, and the tank sinks, so it wants to flip over. Weights should be below you whenever possible, and I have yet to see a situation where someone needed any more than 4lbs of trim weights total on the shoulders. Everything in that post was correct, no absolutes were said, and it was meant for hovering motionless. You can do that with body positioning, that is where you compensate, you can only compensate with trim weights so much, but millimeter precision of weight placement is a joke and is only used for people that are trying to excuse training issues. Any good diver can hover motionless in most normal gear configurations without trim weights unless they fall out of the "normal body type" which a fat person with runners legs certainly would.

 

[Michael Guerrero]

yourself and others have recommended similar approaches to weight dispersion which seems to be a catch 22 as to safety and initial concern for wanting to alleviate the tank neck weight in the first place.

Are you saying you're concerned that putting weights on your shoulder straps, which it would appear your BCD would allow very easily, is a safety issue? If so, how so? Also, on the subject of safety, some people will tell you to take that bungee off your bladder because it's a safety issue if you get a puncture. I'm not advocating that, just giving you a head's up.

I guess the best "hogarthian" approach (for lack of better terms) would be to adjust common gear (fins, boots, tank position, bcd positioning, and "common" weight distribution) and DIVING EXPERIENCE (w/ trial and error to correct body positioning and extremity positioning) as apposed to ADDING additional setup. Compensating skills by ADDING extra setup as opposed to reflecting on the diver itself seems to be placing a band-aid over the result and not the cause (or primary issue).

People will tell you this and that you're just not a good enough diver yet if things don't work for you. And that might be true. However, there is also this thing called physics, which you can dislike, but can't win against. The bottom line is that weight distribution matters (which is why all the suggestions of moving the tank around, moving weight here, there, etc.). Just to be clear, my suggestion isn't to add more weight, it's just to move it to a location that counters your heavy legs. You're diving a floaty BCD, which will exacerbate the issue because the loft on it is all around your upper torso.

My recommendation would be get in the pool, video tape yourself trying to just sit in trim, and work on your rig, posture, arm position, etc. to see how it affects it. Sometimes just extending your arms further forward can make a difference (thought you should still be holding a comfortable position).

Best of luck in getting your trim squared away.

Mike

---------- Post added October 23rd, 2014 at 02:26 PM ----------

Certainly none of the, trim weights on cam bands, trim weights on the tank neck, all of this junk sitting behind you that will make your body want to roll over naturally because you float, and the tank sinks, so it wants to flip over. Weights should be below you whenever possible...

I completely agree that the optimal position for weight is below you if you can do it. Trim weights on shoulders is a bit of a different matter of course because you're trying to get the leverage as far forward as you can. My preference would be to put trim weights on the shoulders first, before anywhere else, because you're likely to need less weight there than anywhere else if you're leg heavy.

, and I have yet to see a situation where someone needed any more than 4lbs of trim weights total on the shoulders.

I needed 6lbs of weights when I dove a soft BCD, but I fall into the abnormal body type category.

 

[tursiops]

I think tbone may not realize that most folks are not actually "normal" in their fat/muscle distribution and body shape. I suspect he can probably buy an off-the-rack wetsuit and have it really fit! Most of us cannot. Put the damn weights where you need them, that is more important than some mythical "arch your back" set of instructions. If you have the right amount of weight to make you neutral at the end of the dive, and it is distributed on your body to make you horizontal when motionless, all the rest of the yoga instructions seem superfluous.

Not that I would EVER disagree with tbone, of course, although I often seem to....LOL.

 

[tbone1004]

I certainly don't fall into normal body style *6'4", 52" chest, 38" waist, 32" inseam, nothing ever fits, the poor tailors weep when I come in to buy new suits*, but it's still comes back to most technical divers you see don't have trim weights on them, they compensate with body positioning. You get close with gear positioning and the rest comes with body positioning. That's why you can do things like put a canister light on and you don't roll over to the side even though you have extra weight on that side, same with deco/stage tanks all being on the left for backmount, that doesn't cause people to dive on their side. Reaching out front to manipulate something, doesn't cause them to flip head down. You learn to compensate with your body and if you have any experience diving multiple types of gear, you learn to adapt. You have to, what happens if you go to rent gear somewhere or have to borrow from a buddy in another country, you can't go "oh well I need a 3lb trim weight on each shoulder, a 1lb trim weight on my tank valve, 2lbs on the top cam band, and another 1lb on the lower cam band because I my chest is fat but my legs sink. I have worked with many divers with all sorts of body types and we have never had to use trim weights to get divers to balance out. 99% of the time proper tank positioning and using the right fins gets you close enough to balance with your body positioning.