How different are tec courses agency to agency

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What I mean is that GUE has a very specific curriculum for the courses, along with their other specific requirements.

So would it he helpful to name the agencies that do not have very specific curricula? Do TDI instructors, for example, fly by the seat of their pants? I can see how it might be possible to rank agencies along a spectrum between a very tightly controlled curriculum to one that gives instructors wide latitude (though perhaps difficult to keep from being biased), but I am not sure it is fair to stick GUE out all by itself as though it's so far off the end of the spectrum as to constitute what you call the "obvious exception." Is it?
 
Do you really want to go that game?

Here you go, it names the shop and agency.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqrwGG7EHpA
Padi SM + advanced nitrox at it's best here

However, I am NOT saying that those agencies teach ****. They don't, there's very good instructors there as well. However, if you find an instructor at GUE that runs courses like shown previously, well, I honestly want to know who it is.

Again, I'm not in a combat for or against any agency, but saying that "GUE is no different" is being blind (to not get insulting). There's no crossover to GUE, instructorship doesn't last a lifetime, ... it's just not the same thing.
 
Where do I start with that video.........[emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Where do I start with that video.........[emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Start by going to the doctor to check out the hernia you probably got from laughing so hard... Complete cluster****
 
So would it he helpful to name the agencies that do not have very specific curricula? Do TDI instructors, for example, fly by the seat of their pants? I can see how it might be possible to rank agencies along a spectrum between a very tightly controlled curriculum to one that gives instructors wide latitude (though perhaps difficult to keep from being biased), but I am not sure it is fair to stick GUE out all by itself as though it's so far off the end of the spectrum as to constitute what you call the "obvious exception." Is it?

Please don't misconstrue my comments as anything negative about GUE. I have nothing but the utmost of respect for the GUE divers I've had the pleasure of diving with here in NC, and I respect their training and the overall attitude of the guys I've been in the water with.

That being said, I'll never be a GUE diver. I like my Kiss LTE too much.
 
this is 100% incorrect
there are huge differences between most [-]agencies[/-] INSTRUCTORS and GUE with regards to tech classes. but this is not one of them. whoever told you this was misinformed

fixed this lol
 
Please don't misconstrue my comments as anything negative about GUE. I have nothing but the utmost of respect for the GUE divers I've had the pleasure of diving with here in NC, and I respect their training and the overall attitude of the guys I've been in the water with.

That being said, I'll never be a GUE diver. I like my Kiss LTE too much.

My curiosity was piqued by your reference to GUE as the "obvious exception." That's all.

I haven't had ANY tec training from ANY agency, so I'm in no position to understand how one agency[s curriculum compares with another's. I know what GUE instructors teach is tightly controlled by GUE, but I don't have any feel for how it is with other agencies. For all I know, there is some agency whose instructors are given such free rein to teach what they want that THEY are more the exception than the rule. For all I know, PADI is the exception. It's not "obvious" to me. Since the OP asked about the differences, I doubt it's obvious to the OP either.
 
Please note my highest GUE qualification is REC 3. My highest non-GUE qualification is IANTD ART, so i'm just a diver who straddles the line between rec and tech.
One of the biggest differences I have found is there are a lot more maths involved in other agencies besides GUE, in regards to working out CNS percentages. GUE have a simple maths calculation to figure out CNS percentages on dives, whereas IANTD have a chart where you have to figure time, PPO2s, etc at various depths and stops, then you add it all together. It's quite a lengthy process.
GUE obviously teach standard gases. If you are diving to a max of x depth, you use x gas. IANTD teach best mix. Personally, I am a fan of standard gases. Valve drill/shutdown procedures are different. GUE= go for the affected post. Once the offending post is shutdown, call the team in to take a look, see if it's fixable/non-fixable and make a decision on whether or not to continue the dive. IANTD=isolator first, save at least half your gas and basically call the dive. GUE's gas switching procedure is a more thorough, longer process, but both courses had team verification before a switch happened.

There were more failures in Rec 3, than there were in ART. Actually ART didn't have any failures, but shutdowns were done on each and every dive. Rec 3 was simple failures and no where near what happens at the tech 1 level. We also had primary light failures, back-up light deployments, spare mask deployments on rec 3. On ART we had a 15m no mask swim followed by an OOG/s-drill, plus a swimming air share. Both courses had loads of s-drills, OOGs, blob deployments, etc. ART also had the highly stressful skill of remove and replace your twinset underwater. That was not fun.

Ascent work was done on both courses as well. But rec 3 had more ascents, as well as varied ascent speeds (9m/min, 6m/min, 3m/min, 1m/min) vs 9m/min on ART. Both courses had us calculate SAC rate, but on rec 3, we were taught how to use our sac rate to guesstimate how long of a dive we would have. Checking our spgs was basically double checking our brain if that makes sense. With GUE, minimum gas is obviously the main gas rule, with either all useable, half or thirds. IANTD was thirds only, with the final third being what we started the ascent at (as opposed to minimum gas).
Rec 3 was a 5 day course, with a total of 9 dives (6 critical skills, 3 experience dives), and 12-15 hours in the water (to be fair, it was August in Croatia). We also went to the max limit of the qualification for the experience dives (40m). IANTD was 4 days with a total of 6 dives (4 critical skills, 2 experience dives), with about 6-8 hours in the water (in February in the UK in a quarry). However, we only hit a max depth of 40m on the experience dives (qualifies to 48m). Both courses stressed the importance of working together as a team. Both courses also went above and beyond the bare minimum requirements, and neither was a definite pass. I feel that rec 3 was a more thorough course skills wise compared to ART (but both were very good courses), but ART actually qualifies me for a higher level of diving (48m with up to 100% o2 for 15 minutes of deco vs 40m with 32% deco max 15 minutes for rec 3).

Personally, I took both courses for very different reasons. Rec 3 opens up a whole load of diving in the UK with a sensible gas choice, while still allowing me to dive within the GUE community. To be honest, when it comes to sea diving, I am quite happy diving to the limits that rec 3 offers me. It is south coast UK diving. The main reason I took ART was to enable me to assist/safety dive/DM on the course at the dive centre I work for. Even though on the course, they do not go below 40m, I still need be certified to 48m for insurance reasons. The skill set on both courses is similar, but there are differences in procedures, a few skills, etc.
 
Here you go, it names the shop and agency.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqrwGG7EHpA
Padi SM + advanced nitrox at it's best here

Again, I'm not in a combat for or against any agency, but saying that "GUE is no different" is being blind (to not get insulting). There's no crossover to GUE, instructorship doesn't last a lifetime, ... it's just not the same thing.
But, what you have showed, in the video and the sequenced still photos, is really not indicative of other agencies either, is it? If you have no dog in the fight, why use isolated examples of particularly crappy diving to illustrate how 'different' GUE is?

I can't imagine that any competent TDI instructor would look at the first example, the video of a Frog Dive course, and not cringe. There are so many things wrong with what the viewer sees that it is hard to watch. In fairness to Frog Dive, the videography is poor, and why the videographer felt the need to try and communicate by shouting into his regulator is not entirely clear.

It is also absurd to label the second example as 'PADI SM + advanced nitrox at it's best'. It isn't, in fact it isn't even close. These are isolated examples of bad form. Of course, the common denominator is that both involve Sydney dive operators. I wonder, should the more reasonable conclusion be that Sydney dive operators are generally crappy? Should that general assessment also be applied to the one facility in the Sydney area (Dive Center Bondi) with the one instructor who can teach tech, even though we have no video of a course taught by that center? I personally don't think either conclusion is reasonable, but I do wonder why you selected two examples from the same locale (Sydney).

If your point is that the number of GUE instructors is quite limited, compared to virtually any other agency, that is a plausible statement. If you want to suggest that, as a result, the consistency of GUE training across multiple instructors is likely to be greater, I would not disagree. I think it would be equally reasonable to say that another difference between agencies is that it may be harder to find a GUE course near where a diver may actually live, or available at a time that a diver may actually wish to pursue it.

I am confident, based on all that I read from people whose opinions I respect, that GUE training is generally very good. I am also confident that it is inane to attempt to bolster the quality of GUE training by showing examples of crappy diving ostensibly representative of other agencies. Notwithstanding your claim that you are, of course, 'NOT saying that those agencies teach ****. ' you are instead implying it by your selection of examples, and your labeling of the examples.
 
I don't have any tech training. Can someone tell me some of the things in that video which were so objectionable? I would like to use this opportunity to learn- seriously.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/
http://cavediveflorida.com/Rum_House.htm

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