I wonder if a BP/W setup might help me to love diving?

[MauiScubaSteve]

First off, you have to decide what kind of diving you will be doing. I will second Nemrod's breakdown of worldwide BP/W users, and add that nearly all of them seem to be members of ScubaBoard.

Second, how can you discount vest and/or back inflate BC's if you have never used one that fit?

Now that there are more BP/W supporters, there are more BP/W's being purchased new, and there are way more BP/W's available on eBay used. We have to assume some of those are being sold by divers who did not find that the BP/W was what they wanted.

 

[Blue Sparkle]

Thanks for your input, Nemrod. I realize you do have a life outside this thread, and I appreciate your time

Also, I am sorry, I will be flamed for it, wings do tilt you over on the surface and do not usually have the ability to float your head as high as a jacket BC. I often dive with a camera so my hands are full and I like knowing my wife is sitting pretty and high enough to breath without every wave washing over her as she paddles to keep from tilting face down without me rescuing her every other minute.

Okay, that could be an issue. I'm normally a pretty strong swimmer, but I know I was a bit tired after my dives, and the day it was very wavy on the surface I wouldn't have wanted my equipment forcing me face down. I don't want my buddy to feel as though he or she has to rescue me every other minute, that's for sure.

The truth is you will possibly wind up with more than one set of equipment, sorry, my wife has three BCs, I have--well--several. It is just hard to shoehorn yourself into a one size fits and does all.

I hear what you are saying. I'm just hoping I can have one set of equipment for the one type of diving I plan to do for the foreseeable future. If that's tweakable, so much the better. On the other hand, if I have to have multiple BCs just for diving in 75º to 85º Florida-type, <60' deep water, than I won't be able to afford diving! More or different gear for a different place or type of diving, I understand.

Diving off that sailboat in the tropics, truth is, you don't need any BC, wing, nothing. People dived for decades without and still do, you can be just as free, streamlined and "fish like" as you were snorkeling.

Ahhh, I wish! Unfortunately, those days are over, at least for the near future. Although if I can get away with buying only one BC I'll be able to go sailing again sooner

Thanks again,
B.

 

[cool_hardware52]

First off, you have to decide what kind of diving you will be doing. I will second Nemrod's breakdown of worldwide BP/W users, and add that nearly all of them seem to be members of ScubaBoard.

So apparently you know how many BP&W users there are worldwide, and you can prove that they are all SB members? Total nonsense.

Second, how can you discount vest and/or back inflate BC's if you have never used one that fit?

Neither of these offers the advantages of a BP&W, namely the plate. Plates add stabilty, and provide ballast up over the divers lungs.

Now that there are more BP/W supporters, there are more BP/W's being purchased new, and there are way more BP/W's available on eBay used. We have to assume some of those are being sold by divers who did not find that the BP/W was what they wanted.

Again more total nonsense. All types of scuba gear is more commonly available on Ebay simply because the economy is forcing many to give up diving.

If BP&W were not becoming more common you'd see fewer for sale used.

There's a lot more used Toyota Camrys for sale than Citroens *Precisely* because of their popularity.

I'll not argue that a BP&W is the only solution for every diver, but these sort of arguments are just plain silly.

Tobin

 

[TSandM]

AGGGGHHHHH! Wings do NOT tilt you over at the surface, and it is perfectly possible to have your head well out of the water when using one! The key to a backplate rig's stability at the surface is 1) adjusting the crotch strap properly, and 2) not massively overinflating the wing. I use a backplate setup in tropical water, in cold water, with aluminum and steel single tanks and aluminum and steel doubles, and I have never, ever, ever been pushed forward on my face. Never. It doesn't happen!

If you use a back-inflate BC of ANY kind that can ride up your body, the lift will push you forward. I can also imagine that, if you use an aluminum tank with a ton of weight on a belt toward the front of you, you could end up unbalanced as well. But with well-distributed weights, it's just not an issue.

Nemrod doesn't like backplate setups in warm water. I do. You may. Renting one from Silent World is a superb suggestion -- try the gear yourself and see what you think!

BTW, from the bottom of my ribcage on the side to the top of my hipbone is about two fingerbreadths wide. I still manage to wear a weight belt, in part because the waist strap of my backplate usually ends up pulled down a couple of inches in the front, anyway. Since there is nothing of the rig on my sides, and that's where the weights ride, it's not a problem.

 

[Blue Sparkle]

First off, you have to decide what kind of diving you will be doing.

I have done that. My diving for the foreseeable future will be warm-water (75º to 85º), relatively shallow, open water diving. I expect to have to add/change gear if I change from that type of diving in the future.

I will second Nemrod's breakdown of worldwide BP/W users, and add that nearly all of them seem to be members of ScubaBoard.

I'm not sure if that is a reason to not consider one? Or am I missing something here?

Second, how can you discount vest and/or back inflate BC's if you have never used one that fit?

I'm sorry if I've given the impression that I am "discounting" other options. I'm not. I'm exploring this option.

That's why I wrote "I wonder if" in my thread title. Again, I'm sorry if it came across like I was not open to options. I guess when you've struggled with things not fitting (due to being short waisted) for as long as I have (backpacks, dive gear, blazers, the driver's seat in my car....), you start get critical whenever you go to purchase something new, especially if it's $500

I have worn a BC that (sort of) fit, but I didn't dive with it -- I was not able to find any in my size to rent for diving, unfortunately, or I would have (that would have been fabulous!). What I did do was try on all six of the Womens' Small model BC's that I could find in dive shops. Spent most of an afternoon there.

But what I think I could tell even from trying it on, was that there was just too much fabric/padding/pocketry/wide straps, etc. to cram in between my hip and my armpit. The wider the straps on the waistband, the more they shove up, because the bottom of the waist strap is what is going to sit on top of my hip (which is my waist).

Now that there are more BP/W supporters, there are more BP/W's being purchased new, and there are way more BP/W's available on eBay used. We have to assume some of those are being sold by divers who did not find that the BP/W was what they wanted.

I agree that people may be selling them because they don't like them, but I'm not sure that means it's not what *I* want. By that logic, a BC would be worse because there are more of those for sale used. Anyway, it's just an option; that's why I'm checking out the idea here now.

B.

 

[StreetDoctor]

I guess I'll be the first... I started diving in a BP/W with 12 dives under my belt, not once have I ever felt being pushed forward on the surface. Proper fit and adjustment is important along with not inflating it so much that the rear dump starts venting. I did 4 dives in a jacket BC, 8 in a back inflate BCD, and the last 150 in a BP/W and I would NEVER go back.

A matter of fact I was just on a recent trip and didnt want to lug my gear around for two dives in the bahamas so I rented a jacket BC.... wearing it made me think of this messageboard... so uncomfortable and cumbersome compared to my BPW. Definitely give Tobin a call he won't steer you wrong. I own 4 of his wings and they are all great.

Edit: I guess I'm a slow typer, lol.

 

[DaleC]

N, I won't flame you but I disagree about the face plant issue. That only occurs if you are overweighted. Then you have to put too much air in the wing to lift you out of the water and it pushes you forward. I have both a jacket and BP/W.

I think one reason there are more BCD's than BP/W's is just a result of manufacterers marketing. The BP/W is bare bones and once you have the pieces there is nothing else to add (except a doubles wing perhaps) - and they last a long time. BP/W owners don't want all the doo dads anyways. Manufacters are constantly trying to sell and re sell products and the BP/W is a lousy platform for them. Every year a new style of BCD comes out "new and improved" with this gadget or that - much better platform for marketers. Hence, most recreational shops won't even carry a BP/W to display and hence most people initially buy a BCD. I did not even see a BP/W till well past OW by which time I had plopped $550 down on a jacket.

Also, most divers (just stating facts) are occasional vacation divers and they are more interested in wearing the latest fashion and point and shoot design. The BP/W requires the divers to think once or twice about the initial set up.
Now let flaming begin

 

[Blue Sparkle]

AGGGGHHHHH! Wings do NOT tilt you over at the surface, and it is perfectly possible to have your head well out of the water when using one! The key to a backplate rig's stability at the surface is 1) adjusting the crotch strap properly, and 2) not massively overinflating the wing. I use a backplate setup in tropical water, in cold water, with aluminum and steel single tanks and aluminum and steel doubles, and I have never, ever, ever been pushed forward on my face. Never. It doesn't happen!

Thanks, TSandM, that's good information. I think a crotch strap will be mandatory no matter what I end up with. There's just no way anything is going to stay down on me otherwise, I don't think.

Nemrod doesn't like backplate setups in warm water. I do. You may. Renting one from Silent World is a superb suggestion -- try the gear yourself and see what you think!

I'm going to see if they have some I can rent, thanks.

BTW, from the bottom of my ribcage on the side to the top of my hipbone is about two fingerbreadths wide. I still manage to wear a weight belt, in part because the waist strap of my backplate usually ends up pulled down a couple of inches in the front, anyway. Since there is nothing of the rig on my sides, and that's where the weights ride, it's not a problem.

Very good to know. Yep, two fingers here, too Then another 8" or 9" up to my armpit and that's all she wrote :cool2: I don't want to leave out anything I need, but I don't have room for anything extra!

B.

 

[Blue Sparkle]

By the way, is it an option to fit a crotch strap to a jacket type BC, if I were to go that way? Of the half dozen I tried on (all they had in my size), I don't remember any of them having a crotch strap.

 

[StreetDoctor]

By the way, is it an option to fit a crotch strap to a jacket type BC, if I were to go that way? Of the half dozen I tried on (all they had in my size), I don't remember any of them having a crotch strap.

You could probably have something sewn on, if it doesn't have the option. I'm not sure where it would connect to on the front though on a jacket bc.