Instructor or Agency or You ?

[El Buzo Loco]

I affectionately refer to my Course Director/Instructor as the "Dive ****." She demands perfection and professionalism.

Ultimately, I'm in control of myself when diving. But when I have other divers in the water that are my responsibility I believe the rigor she placed on my training has had a tremendous impact on my success.

 

[learn-scuba]

Diverbrian -- exactly my point.

Putting standards on paper defines the minimum and that in turn defines the maximum you can hope to get from many.

What has to be done is to weed out those who fail to produce quality courses and to educate the public on why a quality course is more important than saving $15 over the store down the street or finishing in a weekend versus a longer period of time. Teach the market how to be a smart shopper for dive education and the market will remove the bad apples by brute force.

jmho

 

[Walter]

"Concrete, published standards just give the "sea lawyers" (Navy term) a way to get out of putting the maximum effort into class."

"Putting standards on paper defines the minimum and that in turn defines the maximum you can hope to get from many."

Not when those standards clearly allow the instructor to add requirements. I set the standards for my class. Those standards can be the minimum YMCA standards or they can exceed them.

 

[BIGSAGE136]

I taught math in High School here in Florida. Retired from it now but some of my friends are in a quandry. They are in a heated battle over do they teach kids to pass the FCAT or to they teach how to learn.

As a SCUBA instructor I could only begin to imagine the nightmares & hardships you guys have introducing someone to something that is totally strange to them and life threatening to boot. But I would like to say something as a permenant student, because in this sport you never stop learning.

This is my life, and my responsibility. The buck stops with my giant stride into that other world. But please leave me with a solid objective of what I must always strive to achieve. I like the driving comparison. Its a very similar analogy. There is no way I can race cars right out of driving school, and I wouldnt begin to match bouyancy with a group of DIR guys after just getting my C-Card.

BUT...did you leave me with resources, people I could call, videos to watch, books to read. Did you invite me back to your class just to watch as C-Card student to help me get over any jitters I had while I was in your class? Did you follow up to see if i buddied with someone and if I enjoyed the sport as much you hoped I world? Did you point out who your idols were and who you wish you could dive like?

As a student and a former teacher its my opinion that if you did'nt
you missed the bulleye, and the greatest reward of teaching which is watching your efforts come to full fruition.

Safe diving

 

[weekender]

I feel the instuctor has the most responsibility and the most influence on your divetraining. to me it is cut and dry. instuctors are getting paid to provide you a service, in this case scuba instruction. they assume this responsibility by accepting a student into the class. since most ow students have never been diving they will also have the most influence over them until they start diving apart from the instructor. as far as who has the responsiblility for the quality of a persons skills, again its seems very black and white to me. That person, the diver. accept responsibility for yourself. by accepting the c-card and signing it you acknowledging you have completed a basic scuba class and are competent at basic skills. you should of been told by your instructor that you need practice and should dive supervised with either a pro or an experienced person for a while. but if not, be an adult and use some common sense. unless you are a minor this should have been obviouse to you. you want to be a better diver, dive! take a class if you wish or practice with other certifide divers. your contract is complete with the instuctor once the card is issued. they arent required to be your mentor or friend. is it better for everyone if they are concerned with you after the class?sure, but its a business. it is what it its. if you want mentoring or someone to develop the quality of your skills then pay someone or find a mentor. i am responsible for what i do and cannot do in diving, bottom line. im sure some of you will disagree. but you are stupid! kidding

 

[learn-scuba]

Walter once bubbled...
"Concrete, published standards just give the "sea lawyers" (Navy term) a way to get out of putting the maximum effort into class."

"Putting standards on paper defines the minimum and that in turn defines the maximum you can hope to get from many."

Not when those standards clearly allow the instructor to add requirements. I set the standards for my class. Those standards can be the minimum YMCA standards or they can exceed them.

Walter --

I have no doubt there are those who will exceed the standard if permitted. Myself for example and no doubt several others here. The problem, however, is that will be a minority of the whole universe of instructors. It's just human nature... esp. here in the States.

 

[Walter]

"I have no doubt there are those who will exceed the standard if permitted. Myself for example and no doubt several others here. The problem, however, is that will be a minority of the whole universe of instructors. It's just human nature... "

I agree. I've been making that point for years. That is why the standards and therefore the agency is more important than many seem to believe. Standards should be raised.

 

[diverbrian]

The way your training standards are written up, you are cool. The suggestion on the table was an objective, concrete pass/fail OW standard with little or no "wiggle room". That suggestion is what I disagree with. I always learned more from a class when the teacher didn't tell me what was on the test. That meant that I had to at least skim all the material instead of just studying the tiny portion that I knew to be on the test.

My IANTD instructor did tell us the skills ahead of time, but he has the option to fail students for attitude. That is right in IANTD standards. I am not so sure about the recreational agencies with the exception of YMCA.

The instructors here prefer to teach a class above SSI standards as well and even got clearance to give a nitrox class WITH the open water class.

 

[Genesis]

The suggestion on the table was a MINIMUM objective standard.

Nothing would prevent an instructor from exceeding it.

 

[Walter]

"Nothing would prevent an instructor from exceeding it."

Not necessarily. That would depend on each individual agency. I know YMCA and NAUI instructors can exceed their agency standards. PADI instructors can apparently exceed standards as long as it is voluntary. I honestly don't know about other agencies.