Octo vs. Pony

[veggiedog]

Suppose he keeps the octo and the pony, would that be a problem?

Reiterating, octos are a failure point with little benefit (from my humble perspective). Given he is buddy diving though, and only because of that, there are benefits to have a system that a buddy is familiar with. It could be argued I'm splitting hairs, but it sure doesn't seem so to me. I love h-valves (I outfitted my son with an h-valve): best of both worlds (twin second stages and full redundancy). I'm "sortof" frugal too: I would rather have more cheap but reliable regulators and an h-valve than a k-valve and a regulator with an octo but costing twice as much.

I, however, have virtually no buddy diving experience (although I did just get out of the pool with my son: he looks way cool wearing my double hose mistral).

 

[veggiedog]

P.S. I didn't say it explicitly, but I was claiming that I felt he would be better off leaving the octo behind.

 

[AndyNZ]

I dive with a pony some of the time, not all. So it makes no sense for me to take the octi off. I sling the pony on my left hip.

When I take my pony, I make it clear to my buddy that it's mine (mine, all mine!) and I won't hand it over. In an OOA situation, I'll donate my octi and monitor the SPG as we surface. If it looks like my buuddy is hoovering on the ascent, I'll swap to the pony to make sure that we don't suck my back gas dry.

I do all my gas management planning on back gas volume only, so we turn the dive when there is enough back gas to get us both to the surface including a deep water stop and a safety stop at 5m. My feeling is that this makes the pony contigency gas.

 

[veggiedog]

I dive with a pony some of the time, not all. So it makes no sense for me to take the octi off. I sling the pony on my left hip.

When I take my pony, I make it clear to my buddy that it's mine (mine, all mine!) and I won't hand it over. In an OOA situation, I'll donate my octi and monitor the SPG as we surface. If it looks like my buuddy is hoovering on the ascent, I'll swap to the pony to make sure that we don't suck my back gas dry.

I do all my gas management planning on back gas volume only, so we turn the dive when there is enough back gas to get us both to the surface including a deep water stop and a safety stop at 5m. My feeling is that this makes the pony contigency gas.

I also never consider my pony in my dive plan, otherwise it would be silly to bring it along. If you did include it, you would be better off getting bigger tanks (assuming you have redundant systems on the main tank(s)).

As ashamed as I am to admit it, I originally dove solo for many years without a backup second or first stage. No redundant anything. I always felt more concerned about a free flowing regulator sucking up my gas (72cf steel) than I felt concerned about having a backup second stage. I always considered it a buddy thing. Besides, I had a power inflator...

However, pony bottles are strange to many buddies, and Andy has chosen as apparently many do to add a pony to a "normal" system to remain, well, "normal" in most regards. I guess my concern is over the legitimacy of the "normal" system. Not quite sure why I'm so opiniated about octos, but I _can_ see their benefit in a buddy situation due to their familiarity to your buddy. I like to think my opinion about octos is derived from logical analysis. Probabably an "outside the loop" position regarding buddy diving as well.

However, I do know that I am now happier to have a spare second stage in case my buddy needs one. I still dive solo the old way (even trying out "older" ways now), except I always lug along a pony (but not necessarily a spare second stage aside from the pony).

 

[AndyNZ]

However, pony bottles are strange to many buddies, and Andy has chosen as apparently many do to add a pony to a "normal" system to remain, well, "normal" in most regards.

Totally. I dive this configuration when I DM on AOW deep dives and many of the students have never seen a pony before and I explain why I carry it and how it would be used. In those circumstances, it's really there because I don't know the SAC of the students and I want a bigger contingency to cover my own backside. The same dive with a regular buddy, I probably wouldn't take the pony because I know my gas calcs are based on data I can trust.

I admit it, though. I'm just selfish and want to know that I've got spare gas in the event of an unforseen emergency.

However, I do know that I am now happier to have a spare second stage in case my buddy needs one. I still dive solo the old way (even trying out "older" ways now), except I always lug along a pony (but not necessarily a spare second stage aside from the pony).

When I dive solo, I wouldn't normally bother with the alternate second stage - there's no point. I'm just too lazy to take the octi off the first stage for maybe one or two dives before I then dive with a buddy again. The pony comes along on every solo dive, irrespective of how conservative the dive plan.