Relocation of bottom dumps?

[jeremyseattle]

Scott,

I just bought a Brigade in the last couple of months and took it to Grand Cayman. I also purchased the same BC for my Son and my Daughter got the Zema. Anyhow, they all have the same problem of not being able to dump air from the inflator button or pulling the inflator hose unless you either did a 360 or you went into a vertical position.

When swimming normal, the sholder dump doesn't do anything and the dump on the bottom doesn't do anything. If you think about it, water presure forces air to the highest point which is not on the bottom so there IS a difference. My Daughter's BC had the dump valve on the tank side and it worked sometimes (only has it on one side and doesn't dump air on the opposite side.

I am having the same problem with my new Tech and it is causing me quite a bit of trouble.

It seems like the shoulder valve only works 25% of the time when I am in my normal, heads-down, swimming position. I will then try to roll to my right and lift the inflator above my head to dump air there. This might work another 25-30% of the time.

The rest of the time, all the air is in the bottom of my bladder and it is near impossible for me to get to the lower dump valve to remove this air.

I was renting ScubaPro gear prior to buying my Zeagle and I did not have the same issues. It seams that the air is always near the shoulder dump valve on the ScubaPro rigs.

I would really appreciate any tips for resolving these issues. I like the design on the Zeagle but I end up using half my air trying to dump air and stop from popping up.

-J

 

[Chad Carney]

What I think Firefyter is getting at by saying he rarely touches his inflator or deflator once neutral, is that minor changes in buoyancy are best accomplished with breathing control, not with the BC controls.

A diver in a horizontal position that vents air to descend rather than exhaling or kicking down slightly will soon find himself needing to add air to his BC. Likewise a vertical diver that adds air instead of taking a larger breath or kicking up slightly, will very quickly need to vent. It's all about minimizing the need for adjustment for small depth changes.

Lastly if horizontal and ascending the diver is not in a proper position. He can't see where he is going and the expanding air will tend to spread out in the BC, basically not near enough to any exhaust valve to properly control buoyancy.

Small, streamlined and retractable bladders like those on Zeagle's Stiletto, Escape, Zena & Brigade BCs will be very easy to control.

A large and wide 65 lbs lift wing like on the Zeagle Tech will require more body position control than the others.

Chad
FL Zeagle Rep

 

[rjsimp]

What I think is interesting in this thread is that every time someone say's there is a problem with the Zeagle BCs and the air dump ability, it ends up being a "You just don't know how to dive" response.

I have been certified for several years and owned several BCs and although I like the fit and quality of the Zeagle, it is without a doubt the worst BC I have ever had when it comes to trying to dump all the air. When I dive with it, I add a little air once I am at depth, not really an issue during the main part of the dive, but at the end of the dive, I have to go through all sorts of movements at the end of the dive to get rid of all the air when my tank is boyant.

Even in the rinse tank, I have a hard time getting all the air out of the BC and I do have the 30lb lift bladder so it is the smaller one. I end up having to add an extra pound or so of weight with this BC just so I don't have issues during the safety stop and have to fin downwards to stay down. With other BCs, this has never been an issue.

Let's just admit the bladder design or some other issue is causing this problem and FIX IT instead of responding with useless responses on how all the people that say there are issues can't dive and should learn how to dive instead of blaming the BC.

 

[Firefyter]

Let's just admit the bladder design or some other issue is causing this problem and FIX IT instead of responding with useless responses on how all the people that say there are issues can't dive and should learn how to dive instead of blaming the BC.

FWIW, I've been diving a Zeagle for the last 4 years, averaging 50 dives a year, and I've NEVER had the problems you're describing, so I can't say that there IS a design flaw. The other responses may be useless to you, but they're the only thing that makes sense to those of us that haven't had the problems you're describing.

 

[rjsimp]

FWIW, I've been diving a Zeagle for the last 4 years, averaging 50 dives a year, and I've NEVER had the problems you're describing, so I can't say that there IS a design flaw. The other responses may be useless to you, but they're the only thing that makes sense to those of us that haven't had the problems you're describing.

Okay, granted people dive with these BCs, and I have never said that it is not possible as I have even 30+ dives on my BC. However, I have also seen people dive with all sorts of equipment, some good, and some bad. Just because you can dive sucessfully with this BC, doesn't make it the best BC or even a good BC. When compared to other bladder designs and dumps, it is NOT as friendly and causes you to have to work harder to get the air out. I like a BC that when I dump the air, it all (or nearly all) will come out.

I figure I'll just have to find something else that fits good and has a better design for the type of diving I do and gives me better control of the air in the bladder.

 

[wb5plj]

Ok, it looks like the point here is that people dive differantly, with differant styles and differant comfort zones. Like wise differant designs in equipment may make it more suited for one style of diving than the other. In addition maybe avoiding the issuing of commands "you are not diving right", "the equipment is designed wrong" is not the best policy. maybe we could focus on inquiries instead.

I have not been diving that long but am at about sevendy dives. I also dive a particular style which makes my Zeagle Ranger LTD circa 2006 less than ideal in the venting department than I would like. I do not dive 'wrong', nor is the BC designed 'wrong'. I dive in a way that is comfortable and safe to me and alows me to enjoy my diving. Also I very much enjoy many of the featuers and design ideas of the Zeagle Ranger line BC's. it is true however that with my style of diving venting can cause an issue. see here

I had no idea that the lower dump valves had been repositioned on some of the blatters. I personally would concider this an improvement in the Ranger line as well. And if Zeagle is concidering this I would love to hear more details.

 

[pupdiver]

I have not been diving that long but am at about sevendy dives. I also dive a particular style which makes my Zeagle Ranger LTD circa 2006 less than ideal in the venting department than I would like. I do not dive 'wrong', nor is the BC designed 'wrong'.

I don't intend to be argumentative, but it seems to me that people are offering you constructive help. If you are unwilling to consider the possibility that your style of diving is not contributing to your frustration then you are not really seeking constructive help.

You posted a message and people offered their thoughts. I didn't read anything that didn't sound helpful.