Weighted STA and 36# Pioneer?

[ScoobieDooo]

"If you fill that sucker up, you're going to rocket to the surface."

Isn't that what you MAY have to do in an Emergency Ascent situation?

 

[ScoobieDooo]

Aaron,
Its only a hotdog situation IF you don't dive a bungee wing...MY 100# OMS wings stays nice and tight, whether its on my single Al80 or twin 98's.

I don't have any wrap problems...hey, maybe Halcyon needs to start making a bungee wing so that THEIR customers don't have to buy TWO sets of wings AND, have that 'hotdog' effect, eh Taat2d?

 

[Soggy]

MikeS once bubbled...
Now that you’ve made me think about this … the only way I can see the backplate coming off in the water while in the drysuit is with the harness quick release (A.K.A. Sea snips). Still there may be an advantage to having the rig float ... have to think some more about this.

Yes, the rig should float. But the whole point of the ACB is that you can ditch the weights just like with a weight belt.

Come to think of it, I've been on dive boats where the procedure was:

Inflate BC
remove weight belt
hand up weight belt
boat-lacky grabs tank
remove BC
get on board

I have a Halcyon Big Alert Marker with an advertised 40 pounds of lift and don’t leave home without it.

Good plan....this will be a purchase for me in the near future.

 

[Soggy]

ScoobieDooo once bubbled...
Its only a hotdog situation IF you don't dive a bungee wing...MY 100# OMS wings stays nice and tight, whether its on my single Al80 or twin 98's.

True...the bungee wing is a whole other argument which I don't care to get into.

The real question is, why do you have 100# of lift when you only need like 30# with a single tank?

 

[Soggy]

ScoobieDooo once bubbled...
Isn't that what you MAY have to do in an Emergency Ascent situation?

If the feces really hits the fan and you've decided that a guaranteed air embolism is the way to go.

You missed my point. Even with a 36# wing and all his gear, he could rocket to the surface.

 

[ScoobieDooo]

I disagree...I had a friend (Taat2d, was it you?) that rented, I believe a 27# wing, recreational diving, single steel tank, diving wet. Guy at the rental shop says "Oh 27# is MORE than enough. (My buddy is about 220#). Taat2d jump in the water, wing infalted, and preceeds to go straight down like a rock - the 27# wing didn't even slow him down.

Guys, why do you think most jaket BC's are over 40# in lift - maybe becasue you NEED that much for lift at certain times.

And what issues does the bungee wing open up guys - certainly NOT an issue of any 'hot dog' effect.

You gusy simply haven't been able to effectively prove yet that the bungee wing poses ANY reasonable problem(s).

 

[Soggy]

ScoobieDooo once bubbled...
I disagree...I had a friend (Taat2d, was it you?) that rented, I believe a 27# wing, recreational diving, single steel tank, diving wet. Guy at the rental shop says "Oh 27# is MORE than enough. (My buddy is about 220#). Taat2d jump in the water, wing infalted, and preceeds to go straight down like a rock - the 27# wing didn't even slow him down.

First problem...steel tank, wetsuit, and only a 27# wing. Second problem...if he sank that easy, he probably had about 20 lbs too much weight on his belt. This is simple physics. In reality, with a wetsuit and a steel tank w/ SS backplate, he probably should have been in a 36# rig and maybe an aluminum backplate.

You didn't provide enough information to comment and I made some assumptions above, so take it with a grain of salt.

And what issues does the bungee wing open up guys - certainly NOT an issue of any 'hot dog' effect.

You gusy simply haven't been able to effectively prove yet that the bungee wing poses ANY reasonable problem(s).

Look...I'm not arguing anything about bungees. If you want to find out the problems, do a search yourself. I, myself have no experience with them. If you like them, great. All I am saying is that 36# wing will be enough for his setup. Simple math skills will illustrate that.

 

[Dryglove]

ScoobieDooo once bubbled...
I disagree...I had a friend (Taat2d, was it you?) that rented, I believe a 27# wing, recreational diving, single steel tank, diving wet. Guy at the rental shop says "Oh 27# is MORE than enough. (My buddy is about 220#). Taat2d jump in the water, wing infalted, and preceeds to go straight down like a rock - the 27# wing didn't even slow him down.
Guys, why do you think most jaket BC's are over 40# in lift - maybe becasue you NEED that much for lift at certain times.

You have to remember that at the beginning of your dive you should only be negative by the weight of the air in your tank(s) which is why at the end of your dive your neutral cause you used up the weight of the air in your tanks.If someone jumps in with a 27lb inflated wing and sinks like a rock there is some serious weighting issues to be sorted out.Dont blame it on the wing.

 

[Scubaroo]

Just to throw some numbers in MikeS, here's my weighting with the backplate...

Me - 6'3", 220lbs
Rig:
-6lb SS backplate
-2lb STA
-10lb/-3lb LP95 tank
-10lb lead in ACB+
+36lb wing

...plus probably a couple more negative pounds of NiMH canister (maybe -1), D-rings, regulator first stage, buckles, etc.

I'm using a total of -28lb/-21lb beginning/end of dive in weighting, and it's the same for both 7mm wetsuit and trilam drysuit with 300 Polartec undies. Not sure what your bodyshape and condition is, but it sounds like you may be overweighted.

 

[Spectre]

MikeS once bubbled...
I’m also starting to think that perhaps 36 pounds of lift is not enough to float the rig with the ACB so I might be better off with a weight belt. Let’s see; PS HP120 (11 pounds), F-T Plate, (11 pounds), STA (6 pounds), Bailout bottle (5 ponds) that’s 33 pounds without the canister light or reel, yeah looks like a weight belt. Any suggestions, other than the obvious yet expensive, get a larger wing?

I'm not sure you have an issue.

If you need to remove the rig with full gear in the water; I assume you're talking about on the surface; getting out of the water on an aborted dive.

You've got 33 lbs with 36 lbs of lift. It'll probably float anyway since the material [wing, harness, etc...] have some bouyancy.

However the math is a little incorrect. you've got 5 lbs for the stage bottle. If you happen to be in the situation where you have to ditch the rig; ditch the stage first, now you're talking 28 lbs rather than 33.