Why do we call them computers?

[simbrooks]

Why do we call a nose a nose? What are you going to do? Blow your eyes.

A nose by any other name wouldnt smell so sweet

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

Does you GPS tell you useful interpreted data such as:
Time/distance to a destination/waypoint;

Why yes, it does. And I assume they all do, since mine is an obsolete, bottom of the line model.

Calories used;
Other useful info except where you are at this point in time (which is its guage function) and where you have been (data recorder function) - if so its a computer as it is interpreting/processing/telling you things beyond its basic input.

Um, like I said, it does. So, as you said, it's not a simple gauge.

Those who have models and algorithms in them about NDL's, are able to be used at depth, can measure depth and time, and are capable of using that input along with the algorithm are dive computers by their very nature. I wouldnt expect to do word processing on a dive of GPS computer as that is not what they have been programmed to do - just like you cant do everything with a desktop (can you take it UW - if not, should it be called a computer as it doesnt have the answers to everything )

It’s been a long time since my initial post, and a lot has transpired, so I’ll summarize it for you. There are general-purpose devices that we (collectively, our society, not just the dive community) call computers. And there are specific-purpose devices that we (same we as above) do not label as computers. Why is the dive computer handled differently?

All the discussion about computers v. gauges has confused the issue, and what I’ve tried to do is show that dive computers do not fit the common description of ‘general purpose’ any more than gauges do.

HOWEVER, I concede that Jonythan illustrated a couple of other examples that don't fit the mold.

I would wonder if your mental exercise might be better served surfing the fishing channel, they appreciate a good troll there, which i think this is turning into - do you know Novadiver or Lawman per chance?

No one is forcing you to participate in this thread. If you don’t enjoy it go away. If you think it’s inappropriate I suggest you become familiar with the “report this thread” button. In any case, insult is not in order. Keep it professional or keep it to yourself.

 

[Goose75]

I disagree. I think that there is fundamental difference between an analog instrument and a digital one. However, since I've been working in electronics and computers for so many years, I admit that my experience colors my view.

Thinking of computers as a digital instrument is a modern and erroneous assumption. Analog computers existed in the past and continue to be developed. Do a web search on google for analog computer and you'll find some. Electronic too.

Computers are an old invention. A Sextant is technically a computer. Just because we are most familiar with plastic boxes that sit under our desks doesn't change anything.

If you want a term that has no affiliation to other products then you will have to create a new one, convince everyone to use it, patent it and legally pursue anyone who uses the name for a future product that has a similar function. Sell the name to microsoft and they'll do the legal work for you

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

Thinking of computers as a digital instrument is a modern and erroneous assumptions. Analog computers existed in the past and continue to be developed. Do a web search on google for analog computer and you'll find some. Electronic too.

Computers are an old invention. A Sextant is technically a computer. Just because we are most familiar with plastic boxes that sit under our desks doesn't change anything.

If you want a term that has no affiliation to other products then you will have to create a new one, convince everyone to use it, patent it and legally pursue anyone who uses it for a future product that has a similar function. Sell the name to microsoft and they'll do the legal work for you

I think you missed my original post as well:

I have a book titled “Mathematics and Computers,” published in 1957, that generally defines a computer as any device that computes. So it considers an abacus or Pascal’s Calculating Machine to be a ‘computer.’ It has a picture of a mechanical calculator that looks like a pepper grinder, complete with crank on top, and mechanical switches all around the perimeter. The title on the picture reads, “A Small-Scale Digital Computer.” My, how our terminology has changed! By their definition the PADI Wheel qualifies as a computer.

I wouldn't say that it is erroneous, just changed. My question is, based on what I perceive to be the modern definition (general purpose computing device), why is the dive computer labeled as such, when other purpose-built devices (GPS receivers, for example) are not?

 

[simbrooks]

Why yes, it does. And I assume they all do, since mine is an obsolete, bottom of the line model....
Um, like I said, it does. So, as you said, it's not a simple gauge.

If it just told you where you were its a gauge, if it uses that info and the data it has recorded to provide a future prediction (ie length of time to a waypoint) its a computer - you were wondering why they called it a GPS computer, that is why.

It’s been a long time since my initial post, and a lot has transpired, so I’ll summarize it for you. There are general-purpose devices that we (collectively, our society, not just the dive community) call computers. And there are specific-purpose devices that we (same we as above) do not label as computers. Why is the dive computer handled differently?

All the discussion about computers v. gauges has confused the issue, and what I’ve tried to do is show that dive computers do not fit the common description of ‘general purpose’ any more than gauges do.

HOWEVER, I concede that Jonythan illustrated a couple of other examples that don't fit the mold.

I have read since your first post, i think you are trying to see things that arent there, a remote control is not a computer, it is a device. As i said before, computers that only run algorithms on certain subjects are still computers, just not the plastic box type as someone else just pointed out. A common labour saving device that does a simple function when you press it, is not the same as something which calculates things. A dive computer fits the description of a computer for everyone else in the thread except you.

No one is forcing you to participate in this thread. If you don’t enjoy it go away. If you think it’s inappropriate I suggest you become familiar with the “report this thread” button. In any case, insult is not in order. Keep it professional or keep it to yourself.

I just call it as i see it. See the logic above about the GPS being a computer, then you continuing to maintain it cant be a computer even when it is doing the job of a computer - whether it fits the 1957 description of one - i call that a troll in my book, YMMV .

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

If it just told you where you were its a gauge, if it uses that info and the data it has recorded to provide a future prediction (ie length of time to a waypoint) its a computer - you were wondering why they called it a GPS computer, that is why.

No... if you read back you will find that I intially asked why the GPS receiver WASN'T called a computer, while the dive computer is (given basically the same arguement that you present here), then I mentioned (tounge-in-check, complete with ) that I was going to start calling my GPS a computer, not a receiver.

I have read since your first post, i think you are trying to see things that arent there, a remote control is not a computer, it is a device. As i said before, computers that only run algorithms on certain subjects are still computers, just not the plastic box type as someone else just pointed out. A common labour saving device that does a simple function when you press it, is not the same as something which calculates things. A dive computer fits the description of a computer for everyone else in the thread except you

I just call it as i see it. See the logic above about the GPS being a computer, then you continuing to maintain it cant be a computer even when it is doing the job of a computer - whether it fits the 1957 description of one - i call that a troll in my book, YMMV .

Wrong again. You need a new book. And reading lessons. I even tried summarizing, and you didn't understand. I'm not going to revisit any more previous posts to educate you on your misunderstandings. Goodby.

 

[jonnythan]

News flash, the English language isn't 100% consistent. Live with it.

The salient fact here is that a device which gives you NDL time remaining for your current dive is quite a bit different from a device which does not and instead relies on you to use your own table or algorithm to figure out how much time you have remaining.

The industry and the language have LONG since adopted the terms "computer" and "gauge" for these devices, respectively. There were mechanical computers way back when, and there have been gauges - both mechanical and digital, they give basically the same information - for even longer.

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

News flash, the English language isn't 100% consistent. Live with it.

Just don't try to discuss it.

I give up.

 

[jonnythan]

Just don't try to discuss it.

I give up.

Discussing it is one thing. Picking out inconsistancies and complaining about them is, IMO, silly

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

Discussing it is one thing. Picking out inconsistancies and complaining about them is, IMO, silly

Thanks for the jab.

I never complained about the inconsistancies, I just tried to discuss them. Goodby.