Halcyon Backplate and wing

[vioch]

Just my 2 psi:
DSS and Oxycheq use better materials for their wings than Halcyon and Dive Rite.

Halcyon and DR use 1680 Denier Nylon for the outershell, which is asian analog of true american ballistic nylon 1050 used by DSS. OxyCheq uses cordura or material which is lighter than cordura and has 3 times the abrasion ressistance and puncture ressistance than kevlar http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXx_XflRke4


True american-made 1050 denier nylon and cordura are one of the toughest fabrics in the world.

Fore more info follow this link What's the difference between Cordura and Ballistic Nylon? - TOM BIHN Forums: All About TOM BIHN Bags


As for inner bladders - H uses 400 denier nylon cloth laminated with a few ounces of urethane with overall 5-6 mil thicknes of inner bladder, DSS - 30 mil urethane for double tank wings and 22 mil for single tank ones, OxyCheq -25 mil urethane, Dive Rite uses only 15 mil urethane.

The thicker uretane is ablbe to absorb more energy before being sliced. Urethane is also repaired more easily than laminate.

P.S. The best deal on Halcyon (limited time offer) is here http://www.wreckdiversupply.com/shop.html

 

[FishOutUvH2O]

Just my 2 psi:
DSS and Oxycheq use better materials for their wings than Halcyon and Dive Rite.
Garbage in = Garbage out. Nothing you posted below supports, or even indicates your conclusion. . .

Halcyon and DR use 1680 Denier Nylon for the outershell, which is asian analog of true american ballistic nylon 1050 used by DSS. OxyCheq uses cordura or material which is lighter than cordura and has 3 times the abrasion ressistance and puncture ressistance than kevlar YouTube - OxyCheq Mach V Extreme Wing



True american-made 1050 denier nylon and cordura are one of the toughest fabrics in the world.

Fore more info follow this link What's the difference between Cordura and Ballistic Nylon? - TOM BIHN Forums: All About TOM BIHN Bags

Post the lab tests that show 1050 is empirically stronger than 1680. All you've posted is biased links from people who use one particular type in their products and then simply say that it's the best. Even the Wikipedia article on "Ballistic Nylon" doesn't give a source for these "laboratory tests".


As for inner bladders - H uses 400 denier nylon cloth laminated with a few ounces of urethane with overall 5-6 mil thicknes of inner bladder, DSS - 30 mil urethane for double tank wings and 22 mil for single tank ones, OxyCheq -25 mil urethane, Dive Rite uses only 15 mil urethane.


The thicker uretane is ablbe to absorb more energy before being sliced. Urethane is also repaired more easily than laminate.
Here you're comparing apples-to-oranges and making up "facts". Unless, of course, you have test results to show that urethane alone is stronger, more durable, and more puncture resistant than a urethane coated nylon, do you? I also see no reason why one would be easier to repair than another. They are both smooth surfaces that will accept glue/patching just the same.

P.S. The best deal on Halcyon (limited time offer) is here Wreck Diver Supply

If you're trying to say which brand is better based on those premises, you're probably not going to succeed. All of the above mentioned brands have solid reputations and are generally seen as quality products. And based on what you just posted, there is still no clear "Best in Class". The OP's questions dealt with whether or not Halcyon, the brand that a local dealer pushes, are really that much better than anything else and worth the extra money. Nothing anyone has posted, for or against, can answer those questions for sure. The best I could tell the OP was that he would not be buying crap, if he bought a Halcyon.

 

[John_B]

Yeah, but can the H survive a razor blade attack underwater like the Oxycheq?

Mike Nelson would definitely have one of those.

 

[vioch]

FishOutUvH2O feel free to make any conclusion from that I posted above.

I read on this board comparison of Halcyon wing after 400 dives and Oxycheq wing after 500 - not in favour of H. I wish I could find the post, but I cannot. So if you need lab tests, find them by yourself please.

John_B, the ressistance of OxyCheq Exterme series wing seems not to be so funny for wreck divers I know.

 

[astrofunk]

My buddies and I probably have 500 dives between us on Apeks, Agir, Halcyon, and DSS wings. The similarities in quality and performance vastly out-weigh the differences; it's all good gear. Getting a quality wing with the appropriate amount of lift is likely far more important than the particular brand.

That said, since the OP is in Vancouver and asked specifically about Halcyon, I'll point out that the strings in the pull dumps on Halcyon wings are typically of narrower diameter than on Agir or DSS wings. This is a minor beef in the grand scheme of things, but folks around here with dry gloves commonly make their lives easier by modifying the dump valve, or by throwing on a DSS after-market dump valve.

 

[ONESPEED]

well $795 is the best they can do and will only honour that price for 30 days, it goes back up to $865 after that. I am up here in Western Canada and haven't looked around other stores yet. I am also hesitant to buy online without seeing what I am buying, the few things I have bought off of ebay I got screwed

Sounds like a used car dealer, not a dive shop. I'd tell them to stick it with that attitude. I negotiated a MUCH better deal on a Halcyon BP/W and didn't get treated to unprofessional scare tactics like your shop is doing.

 

[FishOutUvH2O]

FishOutUvH2O feel free to make any conclusion from that I posted above. . .So if you need lab tests, find them by yourself please.

I'm always open to learning. It doesn't matter whether it's through new information, healthy debate, data, etc. So asking someone to support their facts didn't seem like an offensive thing to do. What am I missing?

 

[vioch]

I'm always open to learning. It doesn't matter whether it's through new information, healthy debate, data, etc. So asking someone to support their facts didn't seem like an offensive thing to do. What am I missing?

Nothing is missed.
Just small specification - I posted link on source. And I would post the links on lab tests if I had any. But I don't have. Sorry.

 

[Stuman21232]

I will just echo what has already been said. I have both Halcyon gear and DSS and I think the DSS is just as good for less. Unless having the big blue H on all your gear is super important to you, you can save some $ with the DSS stuff.

I do have one suggestion to add though if you are going to go BP/W. I am a big guy and I constantly had trouble getting into my rig with the Halcyon webbing straps (the ones with the pretty blue Hs sewn into the web strap every few inches). They folded over too easily, and got tangled up or twisted behind my back and just made it a general pain in the neck to gear up without a buddy's help. It was enough of an issue for me that I considered going back to regular style BCD that was soooooo much easier to don and doff. Well, then I had an epiphany (great word that) and I went into the LDS here and bought about 10' of the stiff, resin-reinforced web strap material the shop uses to make low cost weight belts for the OW students. (you know what I am talking about, the stuff they will sell you for .75 to a $1.00 a foot that they cut off the big roll). It's thicker and stiffer and made a WHOLE WORLD of difference. With the help of a cheap grommet kit from the local hardware store so I could put that hole in the strap at the top of the plate to anchor the webbing I now have a much more comfortable rigging. (Plus, I got the strap material in a bright NEON Yellow color-- so now instead of everyone asking me about my halcyon rig, everyone asks where I got the super cool looking neon yellow set up.

Now in addition to looking bright and spiffy, I can gear up quickly and without assistance.

Just my .02 suggestion if anyone else has had a similar problem.

 

[halocline]

Check out a place in FL called caveadventurers.com. They have really good prices on dive rite and oxycheq stuff. I have a friend that got 2 oxycheq set ups, both with 30lb mach V wings, 1 SS plate, 1 AL plate, and two hogarthian harness kits for about the same price as your LDS is selling one Halcyon set up.

All these arguments over which one is the "best" are a little silly unless you are diving in super extreme conditions that you need extensive training for, and if you're in that situation, you're not going to be asking for brand advice on a scuba website.

All of this gear is really high quality, with one exception that comes to mind; dive rite has designed some strange single tank wings in the last few years. The quality on them is fine, but, for example, the triangle shaped 45 lb venture wing is a stupid design. Ditto for the big-ass 40 lb travel wing. Lately they have a new travel wing, something like "travel EXP" that looks much better.

OMS seems to come up with innovative ways to screw up perfectly fine gear designs, with excessively padded harnesses, and humongous wings that would be better used as a life raft.

If you get a simple SS plate (just a guess, but you are probably looking for a cold water set up?) a 30 lb wing, hog harness, and STA if the wing needs it, you're going to be happy.