Six left at sea - Thailand

[supergaijin]

Just to be clear, in your post #24, that first quote was not mine. It was from the owner of the dive shop. I don't happen to agree with him on that point, but the problem is not with the diving community, it's with a lack of the "culture of safety" we see in other parts of the world. Unfortunately we are at the mercy of Thai people, which we must by law use to captain foreign owned boats. The places we dive are shared by speed boats, longtails, and fishing boats, non of which have much concern for safety of divers in the water. This is why every guide/instructor deploys a DSMB on the safety stop or when diving the shallows where there is boat traffic. It's mandatory.

I edited the colour of the quote above to try to show that it was not originally from Jo U/W.

Despite the lack of concern for safety in Thai culture, diving in Thailand has a pretty good track record considering the number of boats and divers.

That is true. There are some true professionals in Thailand and other popular backpacker areas in SE Asia who are often tarred unfairly with the same brush as the 'Zero to Hero' crowd.

 

[Mike]

In general, I agree with the sentiment that divers are responsible for their own safety, but this thread is about a boat allegedly abandoning divers in the water. No amount of dive planning could prevent that.

Divers have a lot less ability to prevent being left in the water compared to their ability to be prepared for being left in the water. You can influence the former to a less degree somewhat, you've still got the ability to research whom you dive with and hope that past actions will amount to predicting future actions, you can select dive operators based on abilities, reputation and resources versus low prices, you can select dive operators who have boats closer to minimum expectations if there are multiple choices available such as boats with oxygen on board, more than a single motor if it's an outboard powered boat, a VHF radio etc...

But the latter- being prepared for being left in the water -- divers have a tremendous amount of ability to prepare for that and I suggest every diver IS prepared for it, not being so is just falling back on believing you're on a Disney theme park ride instead of what you're actually doing which is being involved in a highly dangerous activity where if things go wrong they can go terribly wrong. If you're diving without the minimum of a light and a mirror and SMB on every dive, you're just winging it on every dive putting your faith in luck.

 

[Mr. Black]

Id like to see the shop named - looks like Maya Bay at Phi Phi but hard to tell. SMBs should be as mandatory a peice of your gear as your regulator.

I dont know that a personal transmitter would be of much good in Thailand especially as they were diving out of a long tail...have never seen a long tail equipped with any form of radio. Some of the boatmen are great skippers but some have been known to make decisions from a boat viewpoint not a divers in the water viewpoint.

The best PLB for people diving globally / exotic locations is a Delorme Inreach. It uses the Iridium Satellite Network and it is two-way and a private contractor specializing in SAR oversees/drives the rescue coordination with local authorities and private entities. The unit can be taken under water in a McMurdo Fast Find Canister which accommodates the unit perfectly with some room left for a set of spare batteries that you shrink-wrap.

 

[Mike]

The best PLB for people diving globally / exotic locations is a Delorme Inreach. It uses the Iridium Satellite Network and it is two-way and a private contractor specializing in SAR oversees/drives the rescue coordination with local authorities and private entities. The unit can be taken under water in a McMurdo Fast Find Canister which accommodates the unit perfectly with some room left for a set of spare batteries that you shrink-wrap.

If what I read is true the Delorme requires a $20 activation and a monthly subscription of between $10 and $50 a month. If you can use it as a pure PLB without a payment each month that would be pretty good, but I personally don't care for the monthly payments.

I have a ResQLink PLB that has no cost associated with it other than the initial purchase price which is about the same as the Delorme. Also fits in a Fast Find canister. Looks like the Delorme has a few extra features such as messaging where ResQLinks are pure PLBs, and maybe that's why the Delorme has a monthly subscription plan?

 

[Mr. Black]

If what I read is true the Delorme requires a $20 activation and a monthly subscription of between $10 and $50 a month. If you can use it as a pure PLB without a payment each month that would be pretty good, but I personally don't care for the monthly payments.

I have a ResQLink PLB that has no cost associated with it other than the initial purchase price which is about the same as the Delorme. Also fits in a Fast Find canister. Looks like the Delorme has a few extra features such as messaging where ResQLinks are pure PLBs, and maybe that's why the Delorme has a monthly subscription plan?

Correct. The Delorme uses Iridium, a network of 50+ LEO satellites. The Department of Defense is one of the biggest users of this network and it is has truly global coverage (technically there are a few small holes but you won't dive North Korea so that's not a big issue).

The Delorme Inreach can be used on land when hiking/biking/skiing/driving in non-emergency situations and for general tracking as well as having the SOS function. Devices such as the Resqlink need to be registered with your coast guard or other government agencies.

Not an option for someone in Thailand who isn't a Thai citizen. Neither an option in the Philipines and and and (the list goes on... you get the idea.).

For example: In Thailand all PLB are under the jurisdiction of the department of civil aviation and they will never, ever deal with a non-Thai citizen to register a PLB to take out on a dive boat.

If I were to activate my Resqlink somewhere off the coast of Burma, would anyone give a hoot ? If I were an American resident and I had to activate an American-registered PLB off the coast of Indonesia, would there be local infrastructure and resources in place to facilitate a rescue ?

Would I have visual confirmation that my SOS has been received and rescue efforts are under way ? Nope. Hence my comment that for diving in exotic places something like the Delorme Inreach are best. The Inreach is two-way. With the stand-alone unit I will see by the way the SOS light is flashing if my message is sending, has been sent and I will see a positive confirmation once they have processed the message and are initiating rescue. Using it on land in conjunction with a smart-phone they can even ask me questions to get a situation report and mount an even more meaningful rescue. The thing is awesome!

The McMurdo FastFind / ResqLink / Nautilus Lifeline kind of products are great for mostly marine applications in well developed and "civilized countries" with resources. For anyone not fortunate enough to live and dive in such a place, the Delorme Inreach is well worth the fees. I think they have an emergency-only plan that's only 9.95 a month.

---------- Post added November 19th, 2013 at 07:32 AM ----------

BTW I do not work for them I love the thing to bits so people might wonder if I get paid for these comments

 

[Mike]

If I were an American resident and I had to activate an American-registered PLB off the coast of Indonesia, would there be local infrastructure and resources in place to facilitate a rescue ?

Yes

If there are resources that would be utilized by activation of the Delorme for a rescue those same assets would be utilized by the Macmurdo, since they would be notified by either system.

If you go to this map, it's a map showing rescues document using the ResQLink all over the planet, hit the minus sign to zoom the map out

Rescue Location Map - McMurdo Marine | EPIRB | PLB | AIS Beacon | AIS Electronics | VHF Radio | NAVTEX

 

[Akimbo]

I believe divers should always considering the possibility of discovering a new wreck on their dive that happens to be the boat you came out on. I agree with all the comments about PLBs and SMBs but there is another consideration here.

Is it reasonable to expect much from an operator in the third world with such a primitive boat? Perhaps it makes sense to divide the group in half and alternate diving so someone is onboard that you know and trust… and can count heads. They don’t have to be Divemasters with insurance or certifications.

It may add an extra hour to the charter cycle but may be worth considering.

 

[DandyDon]

I believe divers should always considering the possibility of discovering a new wreck on their dive that happens to be the boat you came out on. I agree with all the comments about PLBs and SMBs but there is another consideration here.

Is it reasonable to expect much from an operator in the third world with such a primitive boat? Perhaps it makes sense to divide the group in half and alternate diving so someone is onboard that you know and trust… and can count heads. They don’t have to be Divemasters with insurance or certifications.

It may add an extra hour to the charter cycle but may be worth considering.

None of the boats I've been out on would want to add 2 hours to a 2 dive plan.

 

[Akimbo]

None of the boats I've been out on would want to add 2 hours to a 2 dive plan.

I'm sure they will do anything for a price.

 

[Mike]

I believe divers should always considering the possibility of discovering a new wreck on their dive that happens to be the boat you came out on. .

LOL. I chuckle at the imagery of diving along and suddenly the dive boat comes slowly down to rest on the sandy bottom in front of you!