Canadian woman presumed dead - Roatan, Honduras

[Tool Belt]

CCV makes you do a shore based checkout dive before you can get on a boat. No mask clearing or overt demonstrations of any skills was required. The check out dive was about 45 minured long.

When I did my first dive there a buoyancy check and mask clearing was included. Perhaps that has changed.

 

[mmmbelows]

No I meant C card. In an ideal world the C card means that they know what they are doing. Most of my diving is from boats in NC and some in the Keys. I have seen a number of divers that did not know how to set up their gear, had no clue what their weight should be, or how to check things before they enter the water, nor could they hold position without swimming. This is especially true in warmer waters., Had one instabuddy who told me he was trying to make his air last longer by holding his breath. Sometimes it is because they have not dove for a while and when they do it is infrequent. Sometimes it is because during open water they got a C card because they managed not to drown. The written tests are pretty simple but they do not even have to know all that. The fact that the instructor goes over missed questions does not mean they have learned it nor that they will remember it later.

Right. But if you're certified you're certified, if you're not competent to do the dive don't do the dive. Dive operations are in business to take divers diving.

 

[mmmbelows]

If the boat is drifting, yes. If the boat has their props running so they maintain the same location over the bottom, with a current running at the surface, they will be pulled by the current, just as if the boat was moored in a current.

Let's not forget the wind, all that surface area out of the water can push a boat pretty fast while a diver just sits in the same place

 

[archer1960]

Let's not forget the wind, all that surface area out of the water can push a boat pretty fast while a diver just sits in the same place

Yeah, good point. Depending on the boat, the wind can have a bigger effect than the current.

 

[Divegoose]

Right. But if you're certified you're certified, if you're not competent to do the dive don't do the dive. Dive operations are in business to take divers diving.

Agreed, but unfortunately there are some who are not competent or confident to do a dive, but will not admit it. They will go along with the rest of the group regardless of their abilities. As Steve C said, I have also watched divers, especially warm water divers, who struggle with the basics because they don't dive often enough to keep their skills sharp.

Divegoose

 

[Storker]

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[Terry Harrison]

I am curious, so this dive was set up for the divers to enter the water off the stern, swim (in a mild or inconsequential) current forward on the surface and then pull down a fixed mooring line which the boat is tied into? And the mooring location and mooring line scope is such that the boat does not necessarily end up over the reef, but is actually hanging over the wall in hundreds of feet of water?

If this is the case, it is not a desirable situation - exactly because it makes this sort of scenario so dangerous. I would think the moorings would be located a decent distance from the wall.. i.e., up on top of the "break" - reef .

If I were dropping tourists day in and day out in several hundred feet of water (over the wall),, that would make me nervous as an operator. I think that if the wind and current were not such that the boat would be positioned over the reef, then I might want to drive by the mooring ball and let the customers jump off the boat, swim to the ball and descend. Assuming the ball itself would be located on top of the reef.

I am really curious about the relative position of the mooring ball, the mooring anchor and the edge of the wall.

This dive location was north of Mary Place. I've dove Mary's twice before and this location was a 1st for me. The mooring line was 20-30' in from the top of the wall. Since the wind was coming over the island, it was pushing the boat over the wall. We dropped off the stern, went under water and then moved to the top of the reef. In the three trips I've been to Roatan, this is the 1st that had us over the wall on the drop. AKR normally only dives this side of the island once a week for the trip to Maya Key. Since all of the dive companies were on this side of the island due to the weather, I can only speculate that they had to share locations and more of the dive sites that are not normally used were being used due to the number of boats.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Thanks for the explanation. Sounds like if the drop point was over the reef instead of the abyss, she would have been recoverable by the DM.

I think if I were running the dive, I would have the boat live (untethered) and drop the DM and everyone a 150 feet from the mooring (or break of the wall) and have them simply sink or swim down to the reef then swim to the break. They could come up the mooring line if they wanted.

 

[mmmbelows]

Might be a better way to go, but the problem doing that in Roatan is I don't think there are many dive boat captains familiar with the live boating mentality, just about all dive sites are mooring ball pick ups, with maybe the exception would be the dive site Texas? Maybe a couple others at most? (Doc could clarify all this) With the dive sites having typically only one mooring ball the marine park is self-policing dive traffic on the sites, one mooring ball = one dive boat per site. (more than once, the plan is a certain dive site, you're on your way and you see a boat already moored up, you change plans)

Monkey see, monkey do. All your life as a captain you pick up mooring balls twice a day... windy... boat might end up over the wall instead of over the shallow... business as usual, pick up the mooring ball.

Again, not to beat a dead horse, but the dive operations assume you can dive, over the shallow, over the wall, they don't wake up each morning figuring they might have to recover a body and better apply a method that will expedite it.

 

[crabbyfiddler]

Might be a better way to go, but the problem doing that in Roatan is I don't think there are many dive boat captains familiar with the live boating mentality, just about all dive sites are mooring ball pick ups, with maybe the exception would be the dive site Texas? Maybe a couple others at most? (Doc could clarify all this) With the dive sites having typically only one mooring ball the marine park is self-policing dive traffic on the sites, one mooring ball = one dive boat per site. (more than once, the plan is a certain dive site, you're on your way and you see a boat already moored up, you change plans)

Monkey see, monkey do. All your life as a captain you pick up mooring balls twice a day... windy... boat might end up over the wall instead of over the shallow... business as usual, pick up the mooring ball.

Again, not to beat a dead horse, but the dive operations assume you can dive, over the shallow, over the wall, they don't wake up each morning figuring they might have to recover a body and better apply a method that will expedite it.

You are correct. I have done a couple of live boat entries at sites when the mooring balls have ripped out. Good captains know how to do it. (with CCV) But even if the wind and current pushes a moored boat away from the top of the wall, you aren't that far away. Someone who can't handle submerging and swimming toward the mooring line shouldn't be doing a boat dive, imo. This poor woman's case sounds very unusual.