Regulator servicing

[in_cavediver]

iv had minor probs with regs after servicing but the major probs hav always been after prolonged use in between services .

im divin since '95 and hav seen technology fly at an unbelivable pace .

i do alot of Wreck Penatration divin and alway prefere to hav the knowledge that a Knowledgeable tech looks after my regs , I dive mostly with scubapro rigs and know im buying the best and go to the best dealer to service them .

Steve, more power to you. I personally won't touch Scubapro because of their parts/warranty crap. I look for open manufacturers who don't play those games. With so many good regulators out there, why go for pain?

Oh, and I wouldn't call Scubapro the best. Good yes, but not the best. Anymore, I do predominantly cave dives with some wreck diving. I wouldn't trust any of the 'local' shops to touch my regs prior to going in a cave.

 

[redacted]

im divin since '95 and hav seen technology fly at an unbelivable pace .

What technology are you talking about? The only flying technology I have noticed from Scubapro is the D-series out the window.

I have 11 Scubaro rigs and generally prefer those from the 70's and 80's. But the newest ones do breath ever so slightly better.

 

[Garrobo]

Hello Notso Ken: Servicing your car, to me, would be leaving the vehicle with a dealer to go over all the operational aspects along with lubing it for a fantastical fee. Changing the oil and filter is something that a lot of us do on the spur of the moment in our garage or barn to save a few hard-earned bucks. Don't even need a grease gun any more since there aren't any grease fittings to be found.

 

[GTRio]

I just got word back on my regs that there is a washer missing from the primary second stage, the spring has been stretched, presumably because it had lost some spring rate, and it had a regular nut on the adjustment lever instead of a nylock nut.

I personally can't stomach the idea of some careless dolt servicing my regs. Thumbs up to divesports for noticing these issues, the lds I used to deal with were the last ones to touch these regs.

Something to think about: It’s my understanding that in sky diving part of your training is to learn how to pack your own parachute. Why don't they advocate personal equipment servicing in diving? It’s my air; I should be responsible for it.

 

[MikeFerrara]

iv had minor probs with regs after servicing but the major probs hav always been after prolonged use in between services .

im divin since '95 and hav seen technology fly at an unbelivable pace .

Regs haven't changed much in a very long time.

i do alot of Wreck Penatration divin and alway prefere to hav the knowledge that a Knowledgeable tech looks after my regs , I dive mostly with scubapro rigs and know im buying the best and go to the best dealer to service them .

What I'm trying to tell you is that there is absolutely no reason to believe that a dive shop "tech" is knowledgeable based on the process of becoming a manufacturer authorized "tech". In fact, it really wouldn't be correct to call them technicians at all.

Anual service consists of cleaning, replacing a few parts, setting the intermediate presure and testing (if you're lucky).

The training for such, at best, is just a demonstration on how to swap out those parts. One need not have any idea of how a reg works and they aren't trained or tested on any such knowledge. It's strictly a monkey see monkey do sort of thing and anyone who has the ability to use some basic tools and follow directions can "service" a reg.

I do some wreck penetration too as well as some cave diving and I prefer to take care of my own regs...unless I can get my wife to do it, LOL which is always my promary plan. Wanting to do my own has little to do with safetry though. Contrary to popular beliefe it isn't usually a big deal if the job is messed up...not dangerous, though it can be very inconvenient.

I do my own primarily because I probably own 20 or more regs and paying someone else to service 20 regs (not to mention visual inspection on the 30 or so tanks I own), would just cost way too much and be WAY to inconvenient.

You surprise me in that vertually all the divers I know who do any really serious diving service their own equipment.

 

[David P]

Does anyone else notice the humor in most of these posts? "regs servicing is not rocket science..." "...idiots at the LDS dont know how to service a reg" "....take a simple class from the manufacturer and they think they know everything..." "I'll just DIY next time..." Ok hold on now! If these pasty handed idiots do this for a living after being "trained" by the manufacturers and goof up, what makes you think that you can do it yourself without the training and tools? Ive sat through some regulator classes, some good, some less than good (Oceanic on their Posideon copy "...if the valve is working, don't mess with it! Its too easy to screw up!") in the past couple of years. I also used to work on regulators in the aerospace industry for several years so regulator design and function is not new to me. Guess which regs give me the hardest times to get set... the ones where the owners thought they would save money and DIY. I had one reg come in with completely wrong orings installed, pieces completely bent, nothing tightened... and they said "I dunno, it worked fine the last time I used it...no I didnt open it up..."

People are also complaining about the cost of having your regs serviced. The LDS around here charges $30 a stage. Wow thats $90 plus parts on maybe a $300 reg... fine now lets look at what is needed... first being a retail center, rent is not cheap, electricity, ya need a compressor too, hard to test a reg with no air!, tools (Ive spoke with some scary LDS owners at DEMA "yea these specialty tools are a rip off, I just use different size wooden sticks I buy at the hardware store...") which the cost add up quick, just look at scubatools.com if you don't believe me. Oh yeah the tech, kinda nice to pay him. No given most LDS dont pay employees crap in the way of wages, but how long do you think it takes to service a reg? First you need to hook up the rig, check the IP, check the crack pressure on both 2nd stages, log it all, note hose routing and other assembled doo-dads on the reg, disassemble, ultrasonic, rinse, and then reassemble all three stages. After all three stages are put back together, each stage must be retested and adjusted. Don't forget about the oh so popular paperwork, checking inventory, ordering parts, blah blah blah. Now can you do it yourself, sure! Can you save some money,(ignoring initial investment of tools) sure, but don't forget you still need to buy the parts kits (sometimes extra parts that do not come in the kits too) so the only place you will save money is the labor. How much is your time worth?

 

[Rockhound76]

David,

What you are describing is how it's done when it's done right (and the customer gets what they pay for). What I've gotten in the past is charges for overhauls not done, a first stage not assembled properly and expensive yearlies that constisted of mounting the reg and testing it a few seconds (no cleaning, no breakdown). I know this because they told me.

Despite my concerns, to date, I've always had my reg serviced annually and professionally.

Last night, though, thinking that I might at least try to learn a little about regs, I asked a local LDS for info on training and parts for my Oceanic. What I got in return was "chewed out".

"You can't take a course unless you work in a dive shop" and "you'll never get parts for Oceanic regs if you dont' work for a shops" and the "tools can't be bought by you".

"What should I do with my LIFETIME WARRANTEED '84 Oceanic then?" I asked. "You told me you didn't want to work on it because it was too old and the parts were hard to find."

"Retire it." That was his answer. So much for the Lifetime Warranty (technically expired now, since I'm not getting the annual and will retire it, at least until I get the tools and some knowledge." I'll continue to dive my USD Legend LX and will continue to have it serviced by the LDS, but i will also take it in the pool and test it out myself after I get it back. Lemme tellya, they better not screw up again.

I agree that professional level skills should remain the domain of well trained and equipped professionals. I do not agree that regulator servicing should be a Secret Guild for no othe rreason than the desire to maintain a monopoly on service.

 

[MikeFerrara]

Does anyone else notice the humor in most of these posts? "regs servicing is not rocket science..." "...idiots at the LDS dont know how to service a reg" "....take a simple class from the manufacturer and they think they know everything..." "I'll just DIY next time..." Ok hold on now! If these pasty handed idiots do this for a living after being "trained" by the manufacturers and goof up, what makes you think that you can do it yourself without the training and tools? Ive sat through some regulator classes, some good, some less than good (Oceanic on their Posideon copy "...if the valve is working, don't mess with it! Its too easy to screw up!") in the past couple of years. I also used to work on regulators in the aerospace industry for several years so regulator design and function is not new to me. Guess which regs give me the hardest times to get set... the ones where the owners thought they would save money and DIY. I had one reg come in with completely wrong orings installed, pieces completely bent, nothing tightened... and they said "I dunno, it worked fine the last time I used it...no I didnt open it up..."

People are also complaining about the cost of having your regs serviced. The LDS around here charges $30 a stage. Wow thats $90 plus parts on maybe a $300 reg... fine now lets look at what is needed... first being a retail center, rent is not cheap, electricity, ya need a compressor too, hard to test a reg with no air!, tools (Ive spoke with some scary LDS owners at DEMA "yea these specialty tools are a rip off, I just use different size wooden sticks I buy at the hardware store...") which the cost add up quick, just look at scubatools.com if you don't believe me. Oh yeah the tech, kinda nice to pay him. No given most LDS dont pay employees crap in the way of wages, but how long do you think it takes to service a reg? First you need to hook up the rig, check the IP, check the crack pressure on both 2nd stages, log it all, note hose routing and other assembled doo-dads on the reg, disassemble, ultrasonic, rinse, and then reassemble all three stages. After all three stages are put back together, each stage must be retested and adjusted. Don't forget about the oh so popular paperwork, checking inventory, ordering parts, blah blah blah.

The thing is this. For those who d not want to service their own, the service provided by a good shop (if you can find one) is a fine thing and one should expect to pay for that service.

Now can you do it yourself, sure! Can you save some money,(ignoring initial investment of tools) sure, but don't forget you still need to buy the parts kits (sometimes extra parts that do not come in the kits too) so the only place you will save money is the labor. How much is your time worth?

I can not only save LOTS of money by doing my own but I can save lots of time. I can get a few regs done in the time it would take my just to make a single trip to the closest dive shop (though I would never let that closest dive shop touch one of my regs). In the time it takes me to go back to the shop to get the finished regs, I could do a few more.

Now consider the convenience of being able to do them when I want and have them done when I need them and the peace of mind in knowing exactly what was done and how, and there just isn't any comparison.

Above all, I insist on having the choice just as I do with my car, house or anything else I own.

To answer your question though

If these pasty handed idiots do this for a living after being "trained" by the manufacturers and goof up, what makes you think that you can do it yourself without the training and tools?

...Well I do have the training (or the sorry nonsense that passes for training in this business) and I do have the tools. So, what makes me think that I can do it is the fact that I've been doing it for so long.

 

[MikeFerrara]

Last night, though, thinking that I might at least try to learn a little about regs, I asked a local LDS for info on training and parts for my Oceanic. What I got in return was "chewed out".

that sounds like good business, doesn't it?

"You can't take a course unless you work in a dive shop" and "you'll never get parts for Oceanic regs if you dont' work for a shops"

This is true with some manufacturers. Personally, I refuse to buy, own or use those products. It isn't for your safety though. It's to force you to be going in and out of your dive shop. It's also to stop shops who are NOT dealers for that manufacturer from servicing their equipment...ie, the manufacturer doesn't just want to force you into a shop but they want to be certain that it's a shop that is one of their dealers.

and the "tools can't be bought by you".

This is a lie, plain and simple.

"What should I do with my LIFETIME WARRANTEED '84 Oceanic then?" I asked. "You told me you didn't want to work on it because it was too old and the parts were hard to find."

"Retire it." That was his answer. So much for the Lifetime Warranty (technically expired now, since I'm not getting the annual and will retire it, at least until I get the tools and some knowledge." I'll continue to dive my USD Legend LX and will continue to have it serviced by the LDS, but i will also take it in the pool and test it out myself after I get it back. Lemme tellya, they better not screw up again.

You should test each reg before you dive it but you do NOT need to take it in a pool to do it. The first thing to learn is how to really make sure a reg is working.

I agree that professional level skills should remain the domain of well trained and equipped professionals. I do not agree that regulator servicing should be a Secret Guild for no othe rreason than the desire to maintain a monopoly on service.

There you go. It's one thing to offer a service and market it on the basis of the value of that sevice. It's a completely different matter to attempt to force or con some one into purchasing that service and that IS what they do.

 

[Gil57usa]

I bought my regs new and as long as I get them serviced annually the parts are free. For what I pay for service, it's worth it to me. I could let them slide longer but would then have to pay for parts forever. In the long run I save money and have regulators I am comfortable with.