40m without deep specialty?

[ScottBuck]

PADI Training standards for the deep diver specialty open water dive depths

"The minimum depth required for open water is between 18 to 30 metres/
60 to 100 feet, with no dive exceeding 40 metres/130 feet."

Straight from the manual

 

[Diver0001]

Dare I ask ...

How'd you get to be a DM without learning how to do a deep recreational dive?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Wow, a whole thread full of rhetorical questions:

Bob, You know the answer to this already. It's possible to become a scuba instructor with zero meaningful deep experience. One deep dive for AOW and .... and ... that's it. Technically there *could* be instructors and/or DM's out there with no dives in their logbook deeper than 20 metres.

Technically.

Dave, I find your question a little odd too because I suspect you know the answer already. One thing you might not have considered is that *if* you have an accident at those depths, will your health insurance company try to wiggle out of paying for treatment because you were diving outside of the conditions you were trained for? Never forget: the most important and highest priority task an insurance company has is to look out for themselves first, their shareholders second and their clients last (if at all). Any reason you give them to get out of actually doing what you pay them for will be exploited. Many people think lawyers are the scum of the earth but most of them would go directly to heaven on a rocket ship when compared to what goes on in the insurance world.

R..

 

[Pearldiver07]

When I did my Deep Diver cert my deepest dive on the course was 81 feet. The other dives were in the 70s somewhere.

What a shame. Although your instructor didn't literally violate any standards (I just reviewed the Deep Specialty requirements), he/she didn't do you any favors. In particular the manual specifically recommends doing one dive between 100 and 130 feet.

My last deep specialty went to 118 feet in a lake. Why? To ensure that they're aware of what the local environment was like there. Also, to show them what they may feel in terms of narcosis at that depth. 2 students were narc'd, one was as clear as a bell.

When an instructor just "meets" the letter, but not the intent, of the requirements the student loses out. I hope that all of the out of water consideratios were at least well covered. Or you certainly didn't get your money's worth. Or the potential for learning and experience that may have come in handy later.

 

[elan]

Because you only need 20 dives to start (but 60 to get certified), first aid course done in the last 2 years and to be a rescue diver. To become a rescue diver you only have to be advanced ow which is composed of 5 adventures which are not even specialities... but they let you go deeper after that. So you may not know much about diving, you may not have enough experience but you can be a DM and lead other divers. But I guess you already knew that...

60 to get certified as a DM? :shocked2:

I've got past 50 dives and I barely figuring trim buoyancy etc. I might be very slow learner but I do not see myself leading others

 

[Antarctic-Adventurer]

Resurrecting a (slightly) old thread but I thought that all of the PADI recommended depths were just that, recommendations?

Where does it say that a diver with only OW cannot dive below 18m? I know it recommends that they don't but does that mean it is a PADI hard and fast "Rule"?

 

[Tigerman]

Padi Deep Diver is 40m, a quick look at the specialty page on the website can confirm that for you.

The padi website for AOW says 'typically from the 18-30m range' and with that I'm sure the training dives have a 30m limit.. still kind of hazy. Maybe someone could clarify it from the instructor manual?

According to my "PADI Open Water Diver Manual" Norwegian Edition version 2.5 revision 11/04, page 204;

Depth Limitations:
18 meter/60 ft for beginners
30 meter/100 ft recommended max depth
40 meter/130 ft absolute maximum.

On the list of general rules to use of the RDP (same book and page)
Max depth with scuba diver certification 12 meter/40 ft.
Open Water diver max depth 18 meter/60 ft.
Divers with more experience and training should normally limit their depth to 30meter/100 ft.
Divers with relevant training and/or experience can dive to 40 meter/130 ft

In other words - If youre AOW certified, although its generally viewed as a certification to 30 meter/100 ft it IS within PADI standards, provided you have the "training and/or experience" (good luck proving experience) to dive to 40 meter/130 ft..

 

[Antarctic-Adventurer]

According to my "PADI Open Water Diver Manual" Norwegian Edition version 2.5 revision 11/04, page 204;

Depth Limitations:
18 meter/60 ft for beginners
30 meter/100 ft recommended max depth
40 meter/130 ft absolute maximum.

On the list of general rules to use of the RDP (same book and page)
Max depth with scuba diver certification 12 meter/40 ft.
Open Water diver max depth 18 meter/60 ft.
Divers with more experience and training should normally limit their depth to 30meter/100 ft.
Divers with relevant training and/or experience can dive to 40 meter/130 ft

In other words - If youre AOW certified, although its generally viewed as a certification to 30 meter/100 ft it IS within PADI standards, provided you have the "training and/or experience" (good luck proving experience) to dive to 40 meter/130 ft..

Thanks for the clarification. What exactly is considered sufficient "experience or training" then to progress beyond 18m? There are plenty of divers who have never progressed beyond their OW cert card but have lots of dives and regularly go below 18m. At what point did they "gain enough experience" in PADIs eyes? It is all rather ambiguous, no doubt deliberately so...

And what is the "relevant training" that one is supposed to undertake to increase the depth limitation from 30m to 40m?

 

[Tigerman]

Thanks for the clarification. What exactly is considered sufficient "experience or training" then to progress beyond 18m? There are plenty of divers who have never progressed beyond their OW cert card but have lots of dives and regularly go below 18m. At what point did they "gain enough experience" in PADIs eyes? It is all rather ambiguous, no doubt deliberately so...

And what is the "relevant training" that one is supposed to undertake to increase the depth limitation from 30m to 40m?

The relevant training is probably deep diver specialty, what the "and/or experience" is seems a bit more murky to me..

 

[Antarctic-Adventurer]

The relevant training is probably deep diver specialty, what the "and/or experience" is seems a bit more murky to me..

What depth does the PADI deep diver specialty take a diver to? Really down to 40m? If you aren't supposed to dive deeper than 30m without it then there are many DMs and Instructors going deeper than 30m who according to PADI rules shouldn't be surely..?
I don't personally think it is a problem, just that I can never seem to pin down what PADI's guidelines are... they are so ambiguous.

 

[SkimFisher]

don't confuse not having the card with not having the knowledge. I'm not paying $150 for a card.

thank you thank you thank you thank you