Beginner question for rebreathers

[emilmutz]

I spent today on reading articles regarding "are rebreathers for sport divers".

The authors stated, that even experienced OC-divers have to learn buoancy from the beginning on.

The deeper you dive into this topic, the crazier seems the idea to dive a reabreather (in my case).
To dive rebreather you should live close to the sea where you can dive your RB every weekend.
At least that`s my impression now.

It was also interesting to check the " used rebreathers 4 sale" sections.
You read quite a lot from guys who dove their 8.000 USD RB 50 times and then quit.

Nevertheless, I think there is a market for easy 2 dive recreational RBs as they have their advantages (even above 40m). It just hasn`t been invented yet.

 

[Marie13]

I spent today on reading articles regarding "are rebreathers for sport divers".

The authors stated, that even experienced OC-divers have to learn buoancy from the beginning on.

The deeper you dive into this topic, the crazier seems the idea to dive a reabreather (in my case).
To dive rebreather you should live close to the sea where you can dive your RB every weekend.
At least that`s my impression now.

It was also interesting to check the " used rebreathers 4 sale" sections.
You read quite a lot from guys who dove their 8.000 USD RB 50 times and then quit.

Nevertheless, I think there is a market for easy 2 dive recreational RBs as they have their advantages (even above 40m).

Sea? There are plenty of places where you have inland lakes or quarries to dive that aren’t the sea!

And yes, buoyancy is quite challenging compared with OC.

If you can afford CCR, why not? I never thought I’d do it. Being exposed to my intro to cave instructor (who was also my CCR instructor) who always dives CCR, as well as a numbers of buddies who always dive CCR, changed my mind.

 

[emilmutz]

The 4 O2 bottles mean I can go at least 3 weeks, maybe 4, without having to get O2 fIlls. I can get by for a good bit on 1 fill for the 50s. I have a Kiss Spirit, so dil is off board (left tank feeds dil and wing, right is BO and drysuit). Yes, the entry cost is high for CCR, but the gas logistics are a nice positive.

Yes, that`s an advantage.
But for all what I`ve read so far (here and in articles) there`s to much stuff to take care of instead (at least for me).

 

[Marie13]

Yes, that`s an advantage.
But for all what I`ve read so far (here and in articles) there`s to much stuff to take care of instead (at least for me).

I’m a low maintenance type. CCR stuff has NOT been onerous. All the online stuff makes it seem like it is, but it really isn‘t.

 

[emilmutz]

I’m a low maintenance type. CCR stuff has NOT been onerous. All the online stuff makes it seem like it is, but it really isn‘t.

I didin`t mean the maintainance.
I meant all the additional training which is nessecary to dive a RB savely.

Train permanentely to be able to enjoy the RB on holidays.
I can`t spend that much time on diving (family, work, to many other hobbies).

If I`m not honest 2 myself I end up like all the other guys who sell their RB after 40 dives.

 

[Marie13]

I didin`t mean the maintainance.
I meant all the additional training which is nessecary to dive a RB savely.

Train permanentely to be able to enjoy the RB on holidays.
I can`t spend that much time on diving (family, work, to many other hobbies).

If I`m not honest 2 myself I end up like all the other guys who sell their RB after 40 dives.

It’s all about priorities. If you want to dive CCR, you’ll find the time and funds to do it. If not, then dive OC. I see plenty of people talk about diving goals, but they’re all talk and no action. My motto is Nike’s motto: Just Do it!

 

[Bob Meyer]

Hi all,

my higest qualification is TDI adv nitrox diver (you can see my bio for all my qualis).

I have 2 questions regarding rebreathers:

1.)
Maybe it`s a waste of money but I thought I`d like to start not w a "full-scale rebreather" (200m on trimix) but one which is designed for air/nitrox only.
Maybe you can call it a recreational-rebreather? My goal is diving on max 45m or take longer dives on 20m.
My focus is also on the weight: I want to travel light and as I am only 1,70 tall I had problems with carrying around 2x 12 liter full filled air bottles. So my aim is not only the rebreather itself but to have something lighter than 2x full filled 12 liter bottles. Also I disliked the underwater drag from the heavy tec equpiment. I am 170 cm with 68 kg, so yes, the weight was an issue for me.
My question No 1:
Are there rebreathers for air/nitrox with focus on light weight?

2.)
I learned from my tec diving that it is IMPOSSIBLE to choose the right diving equipment for you on the internet, you always have to experience everything in real dive.
As this is easy with open circuit equipment (avialable everywhere) it looks difficult with rebreathers.

My question No 2:
How do I proceed? Do I choose 1 rebreather and take a training cours on this specific one and then the next class on the next rebreather?
Or is it common in the rebreather-world to test dive 2 or 3 rebreathers, choose the I liked most and start the training course?
I live in Austria, EU. So my possibilties are limited.

Thank you for your help!

Just my opinion, but I think you need to figure out what type of diving are you really interested in and/or is there anything specific you wish to accomplish (i.e. photography, cave diving, wreck diving, just having fun, etc) and how often you're going to be able to do that. The equipment is just a "tool" to accomplish those goals. If you're just an occasional recreational diver, spending $10-$15K on a CCR probably makes little sense. Even the lower cost CCRs like KISS are about $7K. Does your diving really justify that? If so, great! But as others have mentioned, technical diving gets very expensive. I'm an OC-SCR-CCR instructor and my inventory of equipment has my wife threatening to divorce me! ;-)

In regards to your question about light weight air/nitrox rebreathers, Mares has the Horizon, which is really an SCR, but does extend your diving time by 3-8 times over OC and is lightweight. Last year they decided to really get behind the product so there has been a lot of interest in that product as of late. Considering it's less than $5000, it might be a good option.

 

[mr_v]

...is it common in the rebreather-world to test dive 2 or 3 rebreathers, choose the I liked most and start the training course?

It is possible to test a few rebreathers, but you will run into at least two issues.

First, where are you going to find 2-3 rebreathers available for test back-to-back? If you're not a CCR diver, there is a small chance that someone will let you try rebreathers. You can check your local dive shops and see if they offer try dives and then schedule them back-to-back so that you can evaluate the units quickly. Also, you can ask friends to try dive their units, but don't be surprise if people politely decline the offer.

Second, without CCR experience you may not be able to evaluate the units accurately. Some unit features will be apparent, but some capabilities are there to discover only through experience. Therefore, the process of trying units before diving them is a bit nebulous. You'll have to get some support and rely on others' feedback, opinions.

Do I choose 1 rebreather and take a training course on this specific one and then the next class on the next rebreather?

Something like that. You'll get a rebreather, dive it for a while and then figure out what you like or do not like about it. I know a few people with multiple rebreathers and their units are complimentary, e.g., one unit will be for general diving and another unit will be specific for an environment. In general, you want to become proficient on one unit before choosing the next one and that may require more than one course.

Based on my experience, I suggest getting a unit popular in your area so that you can make friends and dive with people who have the same config. It is easier to get started and get help. If you're on the budget, look for a gently used CCR.

If you have $, buy a new unit and know that you can sell it by taking a hit on the resell price. If a unit is $10K and you want something else, you may be able to resell it for $7.5-8K depending on the condition. You can call that hit a sunk cost - the price of your experience.

Finally, you can look for proven older workhorses like Meg 2.7 or Draeger SCR. You can find either of the options for $3K if you have patience and have someone who can review/service the unit for you. These models are not the latest by any means, but I know several people who dive and enjoy them. The beauty of these older units is that they're bottom priced. If you spend $3K, you're likely to get $3K back when/if you sell the unit. However, the road of older rebreathers is not for every beginner and you really have to count on community/friend/shop support there.

 

[J-Vo]

I didin`t mean the maintainance.
I meant all the additional training which is nessecary to dive a RB savely.

Train permanentely to be able to enjoy the RB on holidays.
I can`t spend that much time on diving (family, work, to many other hobbies).

If I`m not honest 2 myself I end up like all the other guys who sell their RB after 40 dives.

I would say that most people who stick with CCR were already training every weekend to do the OC diving they wanted to do.

 

[emilmutz]

Just my opinion, but I think you need to figure out what type of diving are you really interested in and/or is there anything specific you wish to accomplish (i.e. photography, cave diving, wreck diving, just having fun, etc) and how often you're going to be able to do that. The equipment is just a "tool" to accomplish those goals. If you're just an occasional recreational diver, spending $10-$15K on a CCR probably makes little sense. Even the lower cost CCRs like KISS are about $7K. Does your diving really justify that? If so, great! But as others have mentioned, technical diving gets very expensive. I'm an OC-SCR-CCR instructor and my inventory of equipment has my wife threatening to divorce me! ;-)

In regards to your question about light weight air/nitrox rebreathers, Mares has the Horizon, which is really an SCR, but does extend your diving time by 3-8 times over OC and is lightweight. Last year they decided to really get behind the product so there has been a lot of interest in that product as of late. Considering it's less than $5000, it might be a good option.

thx.

the mares was the kind of RB i was wondering if it exists.