Biggest thing killing dive shops?

[KevinNM]

the vacation divers are what provide the numbers to support the industry as it is these days. saying that we should have more expensive and thorough training will only decrease the number of new divers being certified and hasten the end of the industry. it will be back to sewing your own wetsuits out of sheets of neoprene in a garage with the other members of your dive club. like it or not, the industry has become so large that it needs a certain number of divers out there to support the shops and companies involved, especially new divers buying gear and taking classes. the seasoned diver with 20+ years experience that is still diving his conshelf xiv or mk5 and hasn't taken a class since the cold war isn't going to keep the lights on at the LDS. otherwise, you basically have to accept there are going to be quite a few LDS that will go the way of the dodo bird as diving contracts in numbers. there will still be divers, just fewer every year.

It takes 25 jumps for a sport parachutist to get off student status, and I don't think many people are sewing parachutes in their lawn. So I'm not sure that is a reasonable extrapolation.

 

[KevinNM]

You mean like being a serious figure skater probably makes you better than someone who ice skates occasionally?

You are probably better at figure skating. Like guys who race sport cars every weekend are probably better at driving fast than those of us who just drive to work and the grocery store.

 

[scubadada]

I guess I'm a very committed hobbyist. I have no interest in technical diving, caves, serious wrecks or pro photo/video. On the other hand, I do 200 dives per year, go on four diving vacations, and own a 2nd home in a prime diving location that I visit often.

I'm not much good to any of my local shops. I own more than enough equipment for myself and the three other divers in my family, I don't buy very much. I don't go on any shop trips, I organize all my own trips and travel solo or with my family. Since 2005, I've taken only one course, solo, so that people who don't know me will let me dive by myself. So unless a shop owns the boat I'm on or fills my tank, they get very little from me. I guess I don't do very much to prevent more and more shops from going out of business. I do contribute a fair amount to the overall dive economy, I would imagine, like many divers similar to me do. I believe there are a fair number of divers who meet the description, I meet them all the time while I'm diving

 

[Trace Malinowski]

You are probably better at figure skating.

Not me, personally, no. Proving the fallacy of "you are what you eat."

 

[KevinNM]

A Pinarello doesn't meet my needs, nor do a BP&W meet the needs of most Experiential or Occasional divers. But a dive shop sure pushes them hard.

You mush see different dive shops than I do. BP&W is not even stocked at most dive shops. The only dive shop I can think of that I have ever been in that only had BP&W was Cave Country Dive shop, which doesn't exactly stamp out a lot of experiential divers.

 

[Charred]

Two comments:

I think the training that can be found in tropical locations can be excellent and there is no reason to be painting with a wide brush that the "kids" working down on these islands aren't up to the task. As Trace pointed out in his Truth in humor post, those young PADI instructors bring a lot of energy. My daughter was certified in Cozumel and the instructor did all the skills during the dive and mostly neutral. For example, they did the air share at the end of the dive - he swam up to her, gave her the out of air signal, they air shared and then ascended to the SS. Another DM spent a good 30 min in the pool playing "Pirate" with my 9 year old daughter, for free, because I told him she was telling us she didn't want to learn to dive.
Following this and the debate of vacation divers, maybe the problem is that local shops aren't catering to vacation divers. Heaven knows the experience divers arent buying gear or training. Maybe classes need to focus on getting people ready to dive on a vacation off a boat (using a quarry) than preparing them to dive in a cold quarry. Quarries certainly have their challenges, but they don't have current, waves, a moving return point, salt water in your mouth and eyes, etc to deal with.

I know a couple that, in the last year, the wife bailed on her training after the 3rd dive because it was too cold, dark and cloudy at the infamous Dutch Springs. She literally would not go do another 20 min dive to get her card. Her experience was THAT miserable. They took a referral down to the Keys finishing their training while having a great time. Now they hate that scuba shop...

Has anyone ever thought of floating a "dive boat", no engine, in a quarry so students can learn to dive off a boat?

 

[Wookie]

You mush see different dive shops than I do. BP&W is not even stocked at most dive shops. The only dive shop I can think of that I have ever been in that only had BP&W was Cave Country Dive shop, which doesn't exactly stamp out a lot of experiential divers.

Did ya ever see an Atomic T3 next to a HOG? Both will do the same thing for 99.999% of divers.

Which do you think gets pushed?

 

[Wookie]

Two comments:

I think the training that can be found in tropical locations can be excellent and there is no reason to be painting with a wide brush that the "kids" working down on these islands aren't up to the task. As Trace pointed out in his Truth in humor post, those young PADI instructors bring a lot of energy. My daughter was certified in Cozumel and the instructor did all the skills during the dive and mostly neutral. For example, they did the air share at the end of the dive - he swam up to her, gave her the out of air signal, they air shared and then ascended to the SS. Another DM spent a good 30 min in the pool playing "Pirate" with my 9 year old daughter, for free, because I told him she was telling us she didn't want to learn to dive.
Following this and the debate of vacation divers, maybe the problem is that local shops aren't catering to vacation divers. Heaven knows the experience divers arent buying gear or training. Maybe classes need to focus on getting people ready to dive on a vacation off a boat (using a quarry) than preparing them to dive in a cold quarry. Quarries certainly have their challenges, but they don't have current, waves, a moving return point, salt water in your mouth and eyes, etc to deal with.

I know a couple that, in the last year, the wife bailed on her training after the 3rd dive because it was too cold, dark and cloudy at the infamous Dutch Springs. She literally would not go do another 20 min dive to get her card. Her experience was THAT miserable. They took a referral down to the Keys finishing their training while having a great time. Now they hate that scuba shop...

Has anyone ever thought of floating a "dive boat", no engine, in a quarry so students can learn to dive off a boat?

Meet "Ned"

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Has anyone ever thought of floating a "dive boat", no engine, in a quarry so students can learn to dive off a boat?

Dutch used to have a floating platform with a Christmas tree ladder for that purpose.

 

[dmaziuk]

But can you put your gear together by yourself? Vacation divers typically can't. Can you dive independently without a guide? (Not are you willing, but can you? There are many good reasons to have a guide.) Vacation divers get very nervous on their own in a buddy team. Can you navigate back to the entry if given very specific instructions how to? Vacation divers typically can't.

Can't, won't, or don't wanna? My better half is perfectly capable of assembling her gear, doing a basic shore dive on Bonaire and navigating back to the buoy. Yet she always frets and is nervous for the first two or three days of the trip. And we are strictly vacation divers.