There was a similar incident that happened a few years ago. The victim actually fought off the person who managed to reach her. A medical event seems most likely but I wonder at the body position the diver took. Almost as if it was planned.
Canadian woman presumed dead - Roatan, Honduras
- Thread starter DandyDon
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Pinecube
Contributor
Just a thought. Someone who has one hand on their inflator and their other hand holding their nose (to equalize) would fit the DM's description of "arms folded". I would probably not responding to the DM either, especially if panicked, if I'm trying to simultaneously inflate and equalize.
Shasta_man
Contributor
First VERY sad to hear this about anyone. Pierre must be beyond crushed.
DMs signaling people by banging a metal object or shaking a chain, whether for signaling something to see or more important reason, has been a common experience to me.
Aside from whether somebody should have known, my experience is that it difficult to make noise underwater that attracts attention and that banging or making a metallic noise is a classic method of someone trying to signal others. The best assumption is someone is trying to get attention about something important. It could be the DM or another diver trying to get your attention.
To remind readers, on the boat before the dive, you always go through all of the pre-dive checks which include weights in the pockets and closed, all your buckles are closed, checking your air gauge, and taking a few breaths from your reg. Then hit the purge valve on the reg a few times and watch that the gauge stays steady at the same amount and does not bounce the needle or go down after purging. Taking a breath or purging without watching the gauge is not good enough because even when tank valve is off, air pressure is still trapped at gauge, showing pressure in your tank, and giving pressure to your reg, which is why you must watch the gauges reaction to breathing or purging.
Still strange things about this report: definitely too much lead for most people if 3MM suit as I wear 10 lbs with 3MM fullsuit. Still expect to be able to swim up against that. Seems like air off but even that is not instant so seems strange to so quickly start plummeting without trying to stop. Even the "we chased someone to 125 feet while the fiddled with ear equalization" seems strange to be able to not pay attention for that long. I'd also think they would have fixed their equalizaiton problem well before that when their eardrums blew in...
DMs signaling people by banging a metal object or shaking a chain, whether for signaling something to see or more important reason, has been a common experience to me.
Aside from whether somebody should have known, my experience is that it difficult to make noise underwater that attracts attention and that banging or making a metallic noise is a classic method of someone trying to signal others. The best assumption is someone is trying to get attention about something important. It could be the DM or another diver trying to get your attention.
To remind readers, on the boat before the dive, you always go through all of the pre-dive checks which include weights in the pockets and closed, all your buckles are closed, checking your air gauge, and taking a few breaths from your reg. Then hit the purge valve on the reg a few times and watch that the gauge stays steady at the same amount and does not bounce the needle or go down after purging. Taking a breath or purging without watching the gauge is not good enough because even when tank valve is off, air pressure is still trapped at gauge, showing pressure in your tank, and giving pressure to your reg, which is why you must watch the gauges reaction to breathing or purging.
Still strange things about this report: definitely too much lead for most people if 3MM suit as I wear 10 lbs with 3MM fullsuit. Still expect to be able to swim up against that. Seems like air off but even that is not instant so seems strange to so quickly start plummeting without trying to stop. Even the "we chased someone to 125 feet while the fiddled with ear equalization" seems strange to be able to not pay attention for that long. I'd also think they would have fixed their equalizaiton problem well before that when their eardrums blew in...
KevinNM
Contributor
In water deco and omitted deco are two very different things. Omitted deco you are not showing any signs or symptoms of DCS and you can get right back into the water. IWR is when someone is showing signs and symptoms of DCS and is is much riskier.
Omitted Decompression and In-water Recompression (IWR)… some thoughts
never mind
Dan
Contributor
RIP Maurene Lalonde & condolences to Pierre & Lalonde family.
Thanks to Terry Harrison for the detail report of what you witness. This is a good lesson for me.
Knowing that she would have her 700th dive on this trip, this accident does seem to indicate a health issue to me.
For 5'8", 180lbs, 14-16lb weight seems reasonable to me, especially if she wore 5mm full wetsuit. I'm 5'9", 160lbs, using 14lb weight with my 5mm & 12lb weight with 3mm full wetsuit. She seems to know her weight requirement well, as she even instructed the DM where to put trim weight.
So, it sounds like something happened to her right went she hit the water & she fell unconscious in the water.
This is a good reminder to myself to be positively buoyant (put some air in the BCD) before I make positive entry into the water. So, in the case of I pass out for any reason (e.g., head hit a hard object when entering the water), I'll float up, instead of sinking.
Thanks to Terry Harrison for the detail report of what you witness. This is a good lesson for me.
Knowing that she would have her 700th dive on this trip, this accident does seem to indicate a health issue to me.
For 5'8", 180lbs, 14-16lb weight seems reasonable to me, especially if she wore 5mm full wetsuit. I'm 5'9", 160lbs, using 14lb weight with my 5mm & 12lb weight with 3mm full wetsuit. She seems to know her weight requirement well, as she even instructed the DM where to put trim weight.
So, it sounds like something happened to her right went she hit the water & she fell unconscious in the water.
This is a good reminder to myself to be positively buoyant (put some air in the BCD) before I make positive entry into the water. So, in the case of I pass out for any reason (e.g., head hit a hard object when entering the water), I'll float up, instead of sinking.
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Dan
Contributor
To me if decompression is omitted, I would do the same, by going back into the water & stay down in 30' for a few minutes + the normal safety stop. By being underwater at 30' depth, which is equivalent to 2 atmospheres or twice of the surface pressure, you are redisolving some of those tiny nitrogen bubbles that were forming in your blood vessel, at least reducing the size of some big bubbles that may cause DCS.
Pinecube
Contributor
I just re-read some of the posts that Terry wrote and this jumped out at me
Last year-ish I took the rescue course. On the first scenario we were given in the pool dives we had a couple of divers in distress flailing around in the pool. Our instructor (and some DMs from another class that the instructor had waved over without us knowing) were 'encouraging' us to hurry up and 'save him'! This was done to show us first hand why you should never rush into a situation. When you rush things get missed, things get forgotten, mistakes get made. It is best to stop, think, act.
While it is admirable that he is willing to rush in and help when manure hit the fan, he didn't just put himself in danger by doing this. He also inadvertently put his buddy (Terry) and the DM in danger by swimming off, on his own, and into the blue. Essentially there were three divers, not including the victim, who had no buddy at that point in the dive and by the end, two people needed O2 but only one was able to receive it.
That said, I don't necessarily fault him for his actions. I've been in a similar situation (not diving related) and at the time, watching the situation unfold in front of me, all I could think was that I had to take action. Having had time to look back on my actions, and with the added perspective of the rescue course my thinking has changed; hopefully for the better. Personally I would recommend the rescue course to everyone. Not only does it help guide which actions you should take, but when to take them as well.
I am quoting this line from Terry, but it is not directed specifically at Terry.
Last year-ish I took the rescue course. On the first scenario we were given in the pool dives we had a couple of divers in distress flailing around in the pool. Our instructor (and some DMs from another class that the instructor had waved over without us knowing) were 'encouraging' us to hurry up and 'save him'! This was done to show us first hand why you should never rush into a situation. When you rush things get missed, things get forgotten, mistakes get made. It is best to stop, think, act.
While it is admirable that he is willing to rush in and help when manure hit the fan, he didn't just put himself in danger by doing this. He also inadvertently put his buddy (Terry) and the DM in danger by swimming off, on his own, and into the blue. Essentially there were three divers, not including the victim, who had no buddy at that point in the dive and by the end, two people needed O2 but only one was able to receive it.
That said, I don't necessarily fault him for his actions. I've been in a similar situation (not diving related) and at the time, watching the situation unfold in front of me, all I could think was that I had to take action. Having had time to look back on my actions, and with the added perspective of the rescue course my thinking has changed; hopefully for the better. Personally I would recommend the rescue course to everyone. Not only does it help guide which actions you should take, but when to take them as well.
There is protocol for commercial divers for when they do surface decompression. It's been a few years since I was around this but I think they did their standard deco until the 40' stop then they were hauled out of the water onto the ship and had 7 minutes to de-kit and get in the chamber to finish their deco. What the DM did was pretty much along these lines.
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