Certified and Dangerous. Where do we go from here?

[ScooterTDI]

As someone who acts in that roll I consider you opinion more substantial than mine. However still I don't quite agree. If you can't run a class without involving additional less-qualified professionals, the class is perhaps too big.

The class was just us two. The DM was only there on the second day of OW dives. The main reason for the DM was to have someone watch one of us while the instructor went up with the other during the CESA drills. As a side benefit during the nav parts, the DM just followed along to make sure we didn't get lost which allowed the instructor to "catch" us on the way back. The only other thing the DM really had to do was follow at the back during the fun dive part at the end.

 

[herbdb]

I just did a "warm up" dive at Dutch Springs for our trip to Bonaire. We were under for 35 minutes and I enjoyed getting back in the water, but I know I would have found the cold distracting if I was trying to learn to dive.

Have your wife give it another shot on Bonaire. Not only will it be warmer, but you will be amazed at how easy buoyancy is in a light weight suit with no cumbersome hood and gloves. It makes a world of difference.

I started in warm water and had a heck of a time when I first dove in cold water.

 

[Blackwood]

The class was just us two. The DM was only there on the second day of OW dives. The main reason for the DM was to have someone watch one of us while the instructor went up with the other during the CESA drills. As a side benefit during the nav parts, the DM just followed along to make sure we didn't get lost which allowed the instructor to "catch" us on the way back. The only other thing the DM really had to do was follow at the back during the fun dive part at the end.

Fair enough. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[Frosty]

Hiya scooter. Hey it sounds like you guys had a scarey time of it all.
I agree with all the others here that suggested getting more instruction.
One suggestion not intended to be offensive is that you and your wife train seperately.It reads to me that you are worried about what your wife is doing.You are yourself a student so need to be focussing on your own dive skills and let the instructor be the one advising your wife on her issues. To do so I feel you need an instructor you can trust.

 

[clpkab]

We are in northern Virginia.

Just as an FYI - there is a "semi" local dive shop that has their own pool - the dive shop is in Edgewater/Annapolis, MD. (They also have a shop in Gaithersburg, but no pool.) Not sure how long of a drive this might be for you...

The pool is outdoor and max depth I think was 8 ft. Water temp on Saturday was a brisk 66 degrees.

Haven't taken classes with them - I was there for a BC demo day. Got to try out some different BC styles, including a back-inflate. But they were doing instruction while I was there. One group of adults working on theory/book material, and some boys getting pool time.

 

[clay357]

My wife a similar experience. On our check out dives, she panicked twice, pulled the reg out of her mouth and bolted to the surface. When she got past this, every time she let go of the instructors hand, she would head up or down. So, he rarely let go of her hand. Since it was just the two of us, if was basically following behind them and watching. Afterward she said she was not comfortable diving without the instructor. We went two weeks later and did another dive with the next OW class. It was amaazing how much more comfortable she was in the water. We just did our first boat dive, also our first ocean dive and she was great. Just want to encourage you. Follow the great advice you are getting, do go beyond what you are comfortable with but give her a chance. It may take a little time and lots of patience and love, but don't give up on her.

 

[TSandM]

Well, I guess it comes down to how much "qualification" you think someone needs to swim out and back on a nav course, or take divers on a tour. I passed demonstration quality skills, as well as Rescue, and a number of internships with classes, to get my DM. I think I'm qualified to do those things. I may not be qualified to give classroom presentations, or to evaluate skills, but those things MUST be done by an instructor.

And I will say, although it is going to sound incredibly self-serving, that there are instructors I have seen in the water whose diving skills are such that I would rather be in the water with me . . .

 

[Blackwood]

Well, I guess it comes down to how much "qualification" you think someone needs to swim out and back on a nav course, or take divers on a tour. I passed demonstration quality skills, as well as Rescue, and a number of internships with classes, to get my DM. I think I'm qualified to do those things. I may not be qualified to give classroom presentations, or to evaluate skills, but those things MUST be done by an instructor.

And I will say, although it is going to sound incredibly self-serving, that there are instructors I have seen in the water whose diving skills are such that I would rather be in the water with me . . .

Well, take this scenario. There obviously was something left to be taught. I don't believe a DM is qualified in the teaching methods and procedures of an agency. By handing off students to an underwater body guard, the instructor is hindering (or eliminating) his ability to observe, make constructive comments, instruct and evaluate with an eye towards certification standards.

To be fair, it wasn't aware until recently that I knew a DM *could* even do this per agency standards. For the majority of my dive 'career', DM's have been the guys who give site briefings, count you off and on the boat, and hold your fins while you climb up. Later, when I traveled, they even got in the water to lead dives. But I've never had a class that involved a DM.

I have no doubts that many divemasters may be as or more qualified than instructors... unofficially. I guess if I ruled the world, I'd draw the line at the taking of brand new diving students around *during their certification dives*.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

This is another area where some are thinking too much inside the box. There are agencies where teaching classes - giving lectures, conducting pool sessions - are done by DM's. The DM's in our system learn to teach by teaching. Under direct supervision for the most part but I conducted the snorkeling and skin diving sessions for several classes when the instructor could not make it. Also delivered classroom lectures for the same reason. This was of course after having presented them to the instructor and having them critiqued.

When I did my DM crossover the first assignment was to prepare the lecture for the first OW classroom session. Most all of it is done under direct supervision but a DM is expected to be able to take over for an instructor in the classroom and pool if necessary. If I were to come down with laryngitis and not be able to talk, my DM should be able to conduct the classroom session and all I need to do is observe.

I do agree that the instructor should be the one taking the students on "tours". If there is a situation where people are needed to be taken on tours while other are doing skills why not do the skills while swimming on the tour? I don't do any skill evaluations on a platform or bottom. They are all done during the swims and if conditions don't allow me to see the whole group I reduce the numbers on the dives.

 

[davetowz]

I will be back in your area this fall, drop me a note next spring and I will go to Millbrook with you and show you that Millbrook has some pretty cool stuff. Alot of good advice has been put out here, my only addition would be that you sound interested and sound like you are headed the correct direction, hook up with a DM or an instructor on your trip and just keep diving. This is the most awesome sport that exists.